Various ESB Casts discussion.

[BudaFett]

Does it feature the same amount of detail in kill stripe and cat scratch areas?

Yes, in fact it shows the detail everywhere. It’s quite remarkable to feel the cast in person.

Though I am curious about the clean up on the lower left mandible as seen, maybe my eyes are playing games.

 

[RamSkirata]

aggreed.
Funkyred ... by any chance, did you inspect the area BudaFett spotted? And / or do you have more photos that show the area? Maybe MachineCraft could provide some detailed photos of his G2 ?

 

[RamSkirata]

It's your chart so you should proceed as you wish.

My original point was that marking items as official or unofficial implies just that when the truth is that it is all unofficial, other than whatever the licensed company has produced. In theory even the terms like 'sanctioned' or 'blessing' with respect to what may be sold on the board is not really correct. Items sold on the board are simply those that do not conflict with the board code of conduct, i.e. no unauthorised recasting of the work of another member, which is why you have one set of recasts from Machine's 2nd gen cast that are okay and another that are not. I appreciate that this is somewhat a semantic argument. This is the grey area within the grey area that I mentioned because, really, none of these ESB casts should be out there.

As for how messy it will become, well; there's already one ESB derived recast that's not on there, which is the ESB modified to ROTJ helmet from the recently deleted thread. I think we could all see what it was and presumably that is why the thread is gone, but it is still out there so your chart is incomplete without it. I can't imagine it will stop there and someone else will do what was done with the helmet in the deleted thread at some point... and so on.

If this chart was truly to progress in this way then it will end up like the old Vader helmet tree. I did look for that but I have not saved a copy and it seems to have gone from the threads it was once in on some other boards. That thing sought to trace just about everything out there in terms of vader. It was huge and you needed to zoom in and zoom out just to try to read it. It was bonnkers.

Wow... I read that thread. And still the idea off adding it here didn't even com to my mind, because it is RotJ specific. So that went completely past my ESB-mindset. It does however, beautifully illustrate your point. Aggreed. This is a problem. One that I don't know yet how to solve.

Btw... I dont want that to be "my" graphic. Its not my work bringin all of that info to light. The pictures are not mine. Etc. I just wanted to compile it all together in a way that I know I would have loved to have available when I first tried to make sense of all of this.

And right there... There is my answer. I guess this should be my guiding system... Going back to when I was completely green and thinkin about what I wished I had as an explenatory guide.

So this is probably then leaning more into the "too detailed" direction. But that is ok with me for now. What I would like to see happening though is, that someone who is more skilled in doing graphics, takes that and then creates a version with less detail, but also with more visual appeal then what I can produce. And this then would imho really be the best situation for a new guy coming to the site anyways... Having an overview chart to get a little familiar with and if he wishes to deep-dive... he'll have the more detailed version.

If I find the time, I will probably take to the Helmet History Chart, too, in that manner. If there is no objection?
Because, to be quite honest... Even after months of constant reading on here, there is still a lot that I dont understand especially in the PP2-tree. :/ Creating my own version of that chart will mainly help me understand that tree better and also benefit anyone with the same problem that I am dealing with. I am going to have a lot of questions though, just a little warning.

Well... I guess then, that this here text is an interesing example of a explorative writing session or therapy

 

[Funkyred]

aggreed.
Funkyred ... by any chance, did you inspect the area BudaFett spotted? And / or do you have more photos that show the area? Maybe MachineCraft could provide some detailed photos of his G2 ?

No I only have the one image , RS are going to post more images soon from my understanding. The details are really striking. I am unsure what BudaFett means when referring to the cleaned up left mandable ?, but I can confirm there is No bristle and No pinholes anywhere on the cast whatsoever.

 

[MachineCraft]

No I only have the one image , RS are going to post more images soon from my understanding. The details are really striking. I am unsure what BudaFett means when referring to the cleaned up left mandable ?, but I can confirm there is No bristle and No pinholes anywhere on the cast whatsoever.

The bristle in my G2 is specific to the G2 and is not in my G1. It has also already been taken care of. In your image you can see where there is cleanup/sanding done on the bottom of the visor into the left mandible, and then along the bottom of the left cheek. You can look at my G2 cast in my thread and see the detail that was originally there on the G1 castings that either Gino or RS removed at some time.

Here's a picture of the new back panel. Thanks for bringing this up so much so that we could improve it.:

 

[intwenothor]

The bristle in my G2 is specific to the G2 and is not in my G1. It has also already been taken care of. In your image you can see where there is cleanup/sanding done on the bottom of the visor into the left mandible, and then along the bottom of the left cheek. You can look at my G2 cast in my thread and see the detail that was originally there on the G1 castings that either Gino or RS removed at some time.

Here's a picture of the new back panel. Thanks for bringing this up so much so that we could improve it.:

View attachment 193107

Yeah, I thought we had already established, elsewhere most likely, which is why I wanted this thread, that the G1 from which you will be selling G2s and the G2 of yours that had been recast by the mystery man were different cast origins [at the G1 stage]. That's right, right?

 

[BudaFett]

Yeah, I thought we had already established, elsewhere most likely, which is why I wanted this thread, that the G1 from which you will be selling G2s and the G2 of yours that had been recast by the mystery man were different cast origins [at the G1 stage]. That's right, right?

From what I understand the G2 that was recasted did in fact have the bristle which is why the recast helmets all have small sanding marks in that area where the G2 just shown does not but only MachineCraft can confirm.

We already can see that each "official" offering of the G2 will be different from eachother.

 

[KaanE]

Do you have any pictures of those small sanding marks?

 

[MachineCraft]

Yeah, I thought we had already established, elsewhere most likely, which is why I wanted this thread, that the G1 from which you will be selling G2s and the G2 of yours that had been recast by the mystery man were different cast origins [at the G1 stage]. That's right, right?

The G2 that was recast was pulled from the same mould that the G2 in my Sale Thread was -- Lets call that Mould 1. To avoid running into an issue with Mould 1 that would prevent me from delivering Wave 1 on time, I created Mould 2. Mould 2 does not have the hilariously infamous bristle in it.

 

[BudaFett]

Do you have any pictures of those small sanding marks?

I posted the image on post #136. You can see where there has been changes. The bottom of the left mandible shouldn't look like the image Funkyred posted.

 

[MachineCraft]

Do you have any pictures of those small sanding marks?

MF can provide you with plenty of pictures of them.

 

[MachineCraft]

From what I understand the G2 that was recasted did in fact have the bristle which is why the recast helmets all have small sanding marks in that area where the G2 just shown does not but only MachineCraft can confirm.

We already can see that each "official" offering of the G2 will be different from eachother.

This is correct. The picture I posted above is from Mould 2, which matches the Gen 1 perfectly. The Gen3+ recasts have nearly that entire back left panel sanded down where you cannot see the paint detail that is visible in the picture above.

 

[KaanE]

I posted this image on post #136

I thought we were talking about the back of the helmet, not the front.

MF can provide you with plenty of pictures of them.

Yes, maybe you or Buda could too, that's why I asked. I already asked MF but I never got pictures of the left side of the back.

 

[intwenothor]

Machine, Thanks. This is why this is confusing. So, G1 was the same but different moulds that created different G2s.
One with the hilarious bros tile issue and one without. The one with the bro stile issue is the one that was recast by the Milk Tray man and, as a result, those later casts have cleanup in this area to remove the issue.

 

[KaanE]

This was a private conversation with him on May 30th:

Do the back panels lack of paint detail as MC said on his thread?

I’m not sure what he means but no.

 

[BudaFett]

KaanE the recast has sand marks on the back of the helmet where the bristle used to be.

The RS (which isn't a recast) has clear signs of alteration which is an interesting focal point moving forward.

 

[KaanE]

Machine, Thanks. This is why this is confusing. So, G1 was the same but different moulds that created different G2s.
One with the hilarious bros tile issue and one without. The one with the bro stile issue is the one that was recast by the Milk Tray man and, as a result, those later casts have cleanup in this area to remove the issue.

I would love to see the back panels because it makes no sense to me to remove lots of paint details for just a small "hair".

 

[KaanE]

KaanE the recast has sand marks on the back of the helmet where the bristle used to be.

Yes, I got that point, I'm just interested seeing pictures of it (the left back panel with sand marks), as I have not seen any.

 

[BudaFett]

I would love to see the back panels because it makes no sense to me to remove lots of paint details for just a small "hair".

When you're selling a recast it's worth the time to sand a small section smooth. Why? So you can sell it and pass it off as a G2. Then you can make ROTJ editions and lie to the community that the helmet isn't based off the ESB hero. There is a lot of incentive to cover one's tracks.

This is why helmets have "tells" in them. Sand away the bristle, sure but there's other ways of confirming.

 

[MachineCraft]

Machine, Thanks. This is why this is confusing. So, G1 was the same but different moulds that created different G2s.
One with the hilarious bros tile issue and one without. The one with the bro stile issue is the one that was recast by the Milk Tray man and, as a result, those later casts have cleanup in this area to remove the issue.

This is correct. I only had one mould until very recently, and it had the bristle in it. Now there is a 2nd mould without the issue.