Various ESB Casts discussion.

intwenothor

Well-Known Hunter
I think this is a good idea because for sale threads are being derailed by comments concerning the legitimacy, or quality, of what is now on offer. Rather than having a conversation across several disparate threads, it makes more sense to me that we discuss the various offerings in one place.

If this is backseat moderation, which I have been accused of in the past [with some justification], then shoot me. It seems more sensible that we stop clogging up those posts with these views and discsussion and put it all in one place.

It appears that there are currently four public offerings.

Machinecraft's offering.
RS Propmasters' offering.
Wasteland's offering - the 'Fugly'.
Minute's offering.

Sorry if I missed anyone, considering that so many people now have access to ESB casts. Yes, I know that technically it's SE - whatever... and so on.

I think we need to have this discussion at some point, so it may as well be now.

Peace

Andy
 

KaanE

Active Hunter
I think it has become more or less clear. Gino sold one cast to MC fron the eFX mould made in 2012 from the original Hero ESB helmet as it was by that time (that's a 1st gen cast). MC made a mould of it and sold/gave one cast from that mould to a bigfoot (2nd gen cast). That bigfoot had/has ties with Voldemort. Voldemort moulded that cast, and sold some casts to a few (3rd gen casts). One of those was for WF, and one for MF. WF moulded it, made a cast (4th gen cast) and cleaned it. Then made a mould of that cleaned helmet, and nowadays makes casts from that mould (Fuglys - 5th gen cast). MF, as I stated before, got another cast, moulded it and nowadays is selling raw casts (4rd gen casts). He has also made some cleaned up helmets (ESB and SE, with no paint details - 5th gen casts).

Later RS bought another cast from Gino, from.the same mould MC got his (1st gen cast), moulded it and now they're selling copies (2nd gen casts). MC is doing the same.

Am I wrong?
 
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MachineCraft

Active Hunter
I think it has become more or less clear. Gino sold one cast to MC fron the eFX mould made in 2012 from the original Hero ESB helmet as it was by that time (that's a 1st gen cast). MC made a mould of it and sold/gave one cast from that mould to a bigfoot (2nd gen cast). That bigfoot had/has ties with Voldemort. Voldemort moulded that cast, and sold some casts to a few (3rd gen casts). One of those was for WF, and one for MF. WF moulded it, made a cast (4th gen cast) and cleaned it. Then made a mould of that cleaned helmet, and nowadays makes casts from that mould (Fuglys - 5th gen cast). MF, as I stated before, got another cast, moulded it and nowadays is selling raw casts (4rd gen casts). He has also made some cleanes up helmets (ESB and SE, with no paint details - 5th gen casts).

Later RS bought another cast from Gino, from.the same mould MC got his (1st gen cast), moulded it and now they're selling copies (2nd gen casts). MC is doing the same.

Am I wrong?
Yes, you are wrong. And this thread is clearly astroturfing.
 

intwenothor

Well-Known Hunter
I think it has become more or less clear. Gino sold one cast to MC fron the eFX mould made in 2012 from the original Hero ESB helmet as it was by that time (that's a 1st gen cast). MC made a mould of it and sold/gave one cast from that mould to a bigfoot (2nd gen cast). That bigfoot had/has ties with Voldemort. Voldemort moulded that cast, and sold some casts to a few (3rd gen casts). One of those was for WF, and one for MF. WF moulded it, made a cast (4th gen cast) and cleaned it. Then made a mould of that cleaned helmet, and nowadays makes casts from that mould (Fuglys - 5th gen cast). MF, as I stated before, got another cast, moulded it and nowadays is selling raw casts (4rd gen casts). He has also made some cleanes up helmets (ESB and SE, with no paint details - 5th gen casts).

Later RS bought another cast from Gino, from.the same mould MC got his (1st gen cast), moulded it and now they're selling copies (2nd gen casts). MC is doing the same.

Am I wrong?
This my point; I don't know, and trying to work it out across several threads, with some that have been deleted or altered, makes it very difficult to understand.

It seems that there is a Mr X somewhere in the process. Is that your Voldemort? That might be a good handle to work with. I know that there were other casts out there long before all of this in the last few months so it's incredibly confusing to work out what is going on.

In any event, it appears to me that for sale threads have long since descended into discussion threads and that doesn't seem fair.
 
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intwenothor

Well-Known Hunter
So, I'm astroturfing at four possible casts, but this is what I have discerned:

Machinecraft's offering.
He has a 2nd gen cast but is offering 2nd gen casts to match his ears. I infer from various posts that the basis of his casts is a 1st generation cast that is not the same as the 2nd generation cast that has then generated the unauthorised casts that resulted in the Wasteland and Minute casts, i.e. a cast he does not own, or simply a different cast.

RS Propmasters' offering.
Appears to be 2nd generation casts that are from a 1st generation cast direct from Gino.

Wasteland's offering - the 'Fugly'.
A 4th or, more likely, 5th generation cast resulting from the unauthorised recast of the 2nd generation cast of Machine. This cast now approved by Machine.

Minute's offering.
A 4th or, more likely, 5th generation cast resulting from the unauthorised recast of the 2nd generation cast of Machine. This cast not approved by Machine.

In the process of the latter two there is an intermediary that Kaane has referred to as Voldemort.
 

KaanE

Active Hunter
I believe Minute's casts, the paint detailed ones, are a 4th gen, and not a 5th. About the MC casts, if I understood correctly he always had a 1st gen from Gino, but he moulded it to make a copy for himself to be painted and a copy for a friend, a copy which became the origin of the WF and MF helmets.
 

MachineCraft

Active Hunter
That is very childish.
Oh please. Every participant of this thread so far has been involved in numerous threads on the matter and have all come to Luis's defense in some capacity. All of them just happened to find this post within 15 minutes of it going up, and sure enough it has Luis's handle. He has been told he can't sell his helmet here so this is an attempt to keep his name in the mix being that he can't advertise it. He needs to lick his wounds and move on - this is actually pathetic.
 

MachineCraft

Active Hunter
I believe Minute's casts, the paint detailed ones, are a 4th gen, and not a 5th. About the MC casts, if I understood correctly he always had a 1st gen from Gino, but he moulded it to make a copy for himself to be painted and a copy for a friend, a copy which became the origin of the WF and MF helmets.
Once again, you have no clue what you're talking about.
 

intwenothor

Well-Known Hunter
Oh please. Every participant of this thread so far has been involved in numerous threads on the matter and have all come to Luis's defense in some capacity. All of them just happened to find this post within 15 minutes of it going up, and sure enough it has Luis's handle. He has been told he can't sell his helmet here so this is an attempt to keep his name in the mix being that he can't advertise it. He needs to lick his wounds and move on - this is actually pathetic.
I have not and I started the thread. I went to look at ears made by a competitor of yours; that is my involvement. They look good. They fit the helmet they were designed for. Can't afford them, not promoting them beyond that. I think you should step back and develop a sense of perspective because, hey, it's not actually all about you.

I am simply posing a very reasonable thread about various casts. You guys who have, apparently, entirely monetised your involvement crack me up.

There is a serious discussion to be had here. A large number of people are confused by the current situation. I don't blame them. I've been here for a while and I am confused.

So, yeah; childish.
 

MachineCraft

Active Hunter
I have not and I started the thread. I went to look at ears made by a competitor of yours; that is my involvement. They look good. They fit the helmet they were designed for. Can't afford them, not promoting them beyond that. I think you should step back and develop a sense of perspective because, hey, it's not actually all about you.

I am simply posing a very reasonable thread about various casts. You guys who have, apparently, entirely monetised your involvement crack me up.

There is a serious discussion to be had here. A large number of people are confused by the current situation. I don't blame them. I've been here for a while and I am confused.

So, yeah; childish.
You’re entitled to your opinion. In reality this all needs to be added to the collective Helmet History so that the posts of this nature can come to an end and it can all be answered with a URL.

Regardless of whether you’re buying something or not, you were involved and thus this is a conflict of interest. You say childish, I say astroturfing.
 

intwenothor

Well-Known Hunter
You’re entitled to your opinion. In reality this all needs to be added to the collective Helmet History so that the posts of this nature can come to an end and it can all be answered with a URL.

Regardless of whether you’re buying something or not, you were involved and thus this is a conflict of interest. You say childish, I say astroturfing.
I find your lack of objectivity astounding. I looked at some ears. They fit the helmet I was looking at, apart from some observations I made on the right side, which I felt needed a better fit and has been documented elsewhere. There is no conflict here, just some objective posting. Like I said; you money guys crack me up.

You could have chosen to simply promote your product, doubtless a great one, rather than your lengthy and irate posts across various threads. Maybe in future you'll be able to review them and see you've gone further than was necessary. I have not seen vitriol of this standard since the good old bad old days.

In any event, this thread was about casts, not ears, and I think you'll find I haven't promoted any beyond stating that, overall, I think it is an exciting time for Fett fans, your casts included.

Jesus!

Peace.

Andy.
 

MachineCraft

Active Hunter
I find your lack of objectivity astounding. I looked at some ears. They fit the helmet I was looking at, apart from some observations I made on the right side, which I felt needed a better fit and has been documented elsewhere. There is no conflict here, just some objective posting. Like I said; you money guys crack me up.

You could have chosen to simply promote your product, doubtless a great one, rather than your lengthy and irate posts across various threads. Maybe in future you'll be able to review them and see you've gone further than was necessary. I have not seen vitriol of this standard since the good old bad old days.

In any event, this thread was about casts, not ears, and I think you'll find I haven't promoted any beyond stating that, overall, I think it is an exciting time for Fett fans, your casts included.

Jesus!

Peace.

Andy.
I agree it is an exciting time. You misconstrue my counterpoints as being irate, which couldn’t be further from the truth. You said yourself that this is borderline backseat moderation, which I agree with. I’m simply highlighting that it is the same people on repeat trying to put this information as many places as they can. If anyone doesn’t believe me, they can go look at the post history and make a decision for themselves whether or not there is any more to the story.

Products that have posts on the site contain all the information people need to make an educated decision within them. If there is a desire from members who don’t know the details to learn them, it should be in the same place the other helmet history is posted.
 

intwenothor

Well-Known Hunter
I agree it is an exciting time. You misconstrue my counterpoints as being irate, which couldn’t be further from the truth. You said yourself that this is borderline backseat moderation, which I agree with. I’m simply highlighting that it is the same people on repeat trying to put this information as many places as they can. If anyone doesn’t believe me, they can go look at the post history and make a decision for themselves whether or not there is any more to the story.

Products that have posts on the site contain all the information people need to make an educated decision within them. If there is a desire from members who don’t know the details to learn them, it should be in the same place the other helmet history is posted.
You know what the amazes is this; no one yet has even asked me the most important question. When someone asks me that you'll get more objectivity.
Don't paste me into the corner that you have. That is not right and it is not fair. This is a legitimate thread. You are involving me in a circumstance that is wider than you should. I have no interest beyond having looked at something and made some observtions. Metal ears are always bound to look lovely.

Am I a loudmouth? Sure. Am I objective? Absolutely.

I am not questioning your post history, but I'll tell you now, backseat or not, that this ESB business, which should have been wonderful, has been tarred by some awful infighting and some of you have not covered yourselves in glory.
 

Jayvee

Hunter
I haven’t had time to post anything significant for ages, have no vested interest whatsoever and think this is a great thread. I too have been confused by all these new casts, and don’t have the time to wade through all the other threads, so it’s a nice bit of clarity and personally just don’t see the issue.

I’d imagine if the major history thread is to be updated, that would come from Art. In the meantime, any extra info in one spot like this seems like a good idea, unless I’m missing something? Peace.
 
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