General Possible Found part COLLAR STUDS

B0B4F3TT

Hunter
TDH PREMIUM MEMBER
Hello All Dented Helmet!
This is def open for discussion….
Well let me start off by saying I usually don’t do great with long write ups. Ord Mantell and I spoke so I decided to do a little write up. I’m going to give it a go for this particular part.
So something has always bothered me about the collar studs that are out there. I’m not a huge fan of the metal ones because of possibly scratching my armor and the resin ones seem to be like the way to go but I never thought thought the shape was just quite right. That said, I decided to do some research on these pesky lil devils.
I started looking at several Adler adding machines with no luck. Nothing added up (pun intended) lol .
I probably bought about 2 with no luck. I ended up settling on the final adding machine that I think has a strong case for the appropriate keys. Again, I could be wrong but I think the case is there.
Here are the findings….
Machine purchased was a Royal 242PD by the Litton View attachment 213651

View attachment 213646
installed on my fett.
View attachment 213647
here is a comparison created by Ord Mantell and like we discussed, I think there is a strong argument for being darn close.

here are some additional photos. View attachment 213648 View attachment 213649 View attachment 213650

Again : this is open for discussion. I wanna end by saying that I love this community and I appreciate every relationship I have gained from this community. I have made some great friends from this hobby and look forward to continue to talk to everyone. There are a few member here that I can say have became great friends and im grateful.

happy hunting
Shane
Sutt_hero_rotj
Hello All Dented Helmet!
This is def open for discussion….
Well let me start off by saying I usually don’t do great with long write ups. Ord Mantell and I spoke so I decided to do a little write up. I’m going to give it a go for this particular part.
So something has always bothered me about the collar studs that are out there. I’m not a huge fan of the metal ones because of possibly scratching my armor and the resin ones seem to be like the way to go but I never thought thought the shape was just quite right. That said, I decided to do some research on these pesky lil devils.
I started looking at several Adler adding machines with no luck. Nothing added up (pun intended) lol .
I probably bought about 2 with no luck. I ended up settling on the final adding machine that I think has a strong case for the appropriate keys. Again, I could be wrong but I think the case is there.
Here are the findings….
Machine purchased was a Royal 242PD by the Litton View attachment 213651

View attachment 213646
installed on my fett.
View attachment 213647
here is a comparison created by Ord Mantell and like we discussed, I think there is a strong argument for being darn close.

here are some additional photos. View attachment 213648 View attachment 213649 View attachment 213650

Again : this is open for discussion. I wanna end by saying that I love this community and I appreciate every relationship I have gained from this community. I have made some great friends from this hobby and look forward to continue to talk to everyone. There are a few member here that I can say have became great friends and im grateful.

happy hunting
Shane
Sutt_hero_rotj
Hello All Dented Helmet!
This is def open for discussion….
Well let me start off by saying I usually don’t do great with long write ups. Ord Mantell and I spoke so I decided to do a little write up. I’m going to give it a go for this particular part.
So something has always bothered me about the collar studs that are out there. I’m not a huge fan of the metal ones because of possibly scratching my armor and the resin ones seem to be like the way to go but I never thought thought the shape was just quite right. That said, I decided to do some research on these pesky lil devils.
I started looking at several Adler adding machines with no luck. Nothing added up (pun intended) lol .
I probably bought about 2 with no luck. I ended up settling on the final adding machine that I think has a strong case for the appropriate keys. Again, I could be wrong but I think the case is there.
Here are the findings….
Machine purchased was a Royal 242PD by the Litton View attachment 213651

View attachment 213646
installed on my fett.
View attachment 213647
here is a comparison created by Ord Mantell and like we discussed, I think there is a strong argument for being darn close.

here are some additional photos. View attachment 213648 View attachment 213649 View attachment 213650

Again : this is open for discussion. I wanna end by saying that I love this community and I appreciate every relationship I have gained from this community. I have made some great friends from this hobby and look forward to continue to talk to everyone. There are a few member here that I can say have became great friends and im grateful.

happy hunting
Shane
Sutt_hero_rotj
 

Ord Mantell

Active Hunter
Thanks for measuring! I think it might be a winner
So far it holds up. Certainly the best candidate to date. I'm still taking comparison pics. Would also like to confirm when these were on the market. I opened mine up to look at the interior electronics looking for dates codes. There is a Sharp IR2403 chip on the board with what looks like a date code of 905, which would be week 5 of 1979. If correct, it would be consistent with the time period, assuming my unit was not manufactured at the beginning of the model's run. The model needed to be available in 1978. Although, looking at other models of the same maker, this does not seem to be the only unit with these particular keys, so the originals could be from an earlier model as well.
 
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dimensions are pretty much spot on! the curve top surface still bothers me, anyone notices that? it's subtle, i don't see those curves on the real deal, hmmm


stud1a.jpg
 

SPY007

Active Hunter
So, I found one too. Have extras. Is the thinking that the studs should be flat?
 

Attachments

  • Collar Studs Installed.jpg
    Collar Studs Installed.jpg
    1.4 MB · Views: 100
  • Royal Buttons.jpg
    Royal Buttons.jpg
    1.1 MB · Views: 101

Ord Mantell

Active Hunter
I've been trying to take a closer look at these by taking photo studies and comparing to what's in the media gallery. These are just observations. There are plenty of factors with this approach which can lead one astray and reach the wrong conclusions: the angle not being exactly the same, lighting not matching exactly the same, the amount of light coming from the flash, the surface area of the flash, the position of the flash relative to the lens, the quality and thickness of the paint, weathering differences causing illusions, etc. But even with these problems, I've noticed a couple of things about the Royal keys that seem a little off from the originals, beyond just the differences of topology on the top surface.

I'm using the key I sanded down for the comparisons. My DSLR isn't working, and my iphone 12 pro, although it has a great camera on it, couldn't take pics that recreated the right look with the flash, so I got out my old 2005 Canon Elph for these.

The degree of pinch in the lower corners seems to be tighter on the originals (original on the left)
#3.jpg


(original on bottom)
#2.jpg


(originals on bottom)
#1.jpg


there also seems to be more curvature in the upper portion of the sides, where it indents just slightly before coming to the top, and where it meets the top seems to flare out very subtly. (originals on bottom)

#5.jpg



I literally took hundreds of photos and spent a lot of time looking over them. There is nothing conclusive to say about them other than it's not a 100% slam dunk these are the correct keys. They are so close, it suggests to me that if these are not the ones, it may be an earlier model, or perhaps another make that these were emulating (or vice versa). Or maybe these are the ones and my photo recreations are not accurate in some critical way.

Here, my flattened key is floating about the two originals in the photo:
#4.jpg



couple more photos of my flattened key on my ROTJ display:
IMG_1883.jpg

IMG_1877.jpg


If these are not the correct keys, you could do worse. They're so close it might almost be moot. Although it might be worth the effort to look at earlier Royal models.
 

sutt_hero_rotj

Active Hunter
TDH PREMIUM MEMBER
I've been trying to take a closer look at these by taking photo studies and comparing to what's in the media gallery. These are just observations. There are plenty of factors with this approach which can lead one astray and reach the wrong conclusions: the angle not being exactly the same, lighting not matching exactly the same, the amount of light coming from the flash, the surface area of the flash, the position of the flash relative to the lens, the quality and thickness of the paint, weathering differences causing illusions, etc. But even with these problems, I've noticed a couple of things about the Royal keys that seem a little off from the originals, beyond just the differences of topology on the top surface.

I'm using the key I sanded down for the comparisons. My DSLR isn't working, and my iphone 12 pro, although it has a great camera on it, couldn't take pics that recreated the right look with the flash, so I got out my old 2005 Canon Elph for these.

The degree of pinch in the lower corners seems to be tighter on the originals (original on the left)
View attachment 214049

(original on bottom)
View attachment 214050

(originals on bottom)
View attachment 214051

there also seems to be more curvature in the upper portion of the sides, where it indents just slightly before coming to the top, and where it meets the top seems to flare out very subtly. (originals on bottom)

View attachment 214052


I literally took hundreds of photos and spent a lot of time looking over them. There is nothing conclusive to say about them other than it's not a 100% slam dunk these are the correct keys. They are so close, it suggests to me that if these are not the ones, it may be an earlier model, or perhaps another make that these were emulating (or vice versa). Or maybe these are the ones and my photo recreations are not accurate in some critical way.

Here, my flattened key is floating about the two originals in the photo:
View attachment 214053


couple more photos of my flattened key on my ROTJ display:
View attachment 214054
View attachment 214055

If these are not the correct keys, you could do worse. They're so close it might almost be moot. Although it might be worth the effort to look at earlier Royal models.
Strong work Ord ! We’re certainly close.
 

RafalFett

Well-Known Hunter
There seems to be 2 different versions on the ROTJ era suits. Most of the shoulder studs looks to be almost identical to the Royal keys:
Studs.jpg


And the other version with straight lines on the rounded edges found on the MoM/DaG/SWtE cod, but also on the AoSW/C-IV right outer shoulder stud:
Shoulder and Cod Studs 1.jpg
Shoulder and Cod Studs 2.jpg
Shoulder Studs.jpg


The cod stud looks to be shorter with 1mm. Also, I think these might have been cast to allow the installation of metal nuts inside the studs:
Stud Metal Nuts 1.jpg
Stud Metal Nuts 2.jpg
 

Ord Mantell

Active Hunter
I contacted Litton Royal over the phone. Luckily they are still intact as a company and the costumer service rep was able to give me some useful info. First, they made several models starting in the early 1970's and well into the early 80's. The following models would have been available in 1978:
242PD
228PD
244PD
248PD
248PD II
248PD III

These other models are worth taking a look at. They might all have the same key style. As these were manufactured over time, the model numbers did not change, though internal parts might have, meaning the key style could very well be different among units made at different times. For example, my unit was likely assembled in early to mid 1979, based on the date codes on the board chips. Now, the bad news is you can't tell what year a unit was made by any external markings. You have to open it up and look at the board to get an idea, though chip date codes don't give a manufacturing date of the unit, they give only an aproximation based on the date of the chip. I think for our purposes it would be great if anyone could find a unit with '77 or '78 dated chips and have a look at it's keys to see if they are different at all.

if you open it up you should see these chips on the board. The Sharp seems to have a YWW code, or could be YMM:
IMG_1896.jpg
 
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