Dakota, when you say recast, are you referring to resin or something else? I guess I don’t understand your comment since your work is one of a kind and I don’t see anyone being able to replicate it. I think with the originals in some circulation, this would have already happened. Anyway, thank you for all the time and money you’ve invested so far. I really hope these are offered (Vader Reveal reasons as well).
General The MachineCraft Dental Expander Project – Glenross Replicas
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Dakota, when you say recast, are you referring to resin or something else? I guess I don’t understand your comment since your work is one of a kind and I don’t see anyone being able to replicate it. I think with the originals in some circulation, this would have already happened. Anyway, thank you for all the time and money you’ve invested so far. I really hope these are offered (Vader Reveal reasons as well).
MachineCraft
Active Hunter
Hey Rob,
I'm mostly referring to the slimeballs that have put calipers on my parts and call it their own work. If you don't want to call it recasting because it doesn't involve silicone/resin, you can just call it what it really is - Stealing somebody else's work for profit. Parts like my jetpack beacon that I invested both large amounts of time into developing, and a large amount of money to stock enough inventory that they have and will be continuously available (as opposed to offering parts via 'runs' like the metal vendors before me did). So to see people not only turn a blind eye to the recasting, but to also support the individuals in question via promotion, product development, or just by knowingly buying recast parts is pretty disgusting in my opinion.
Including my helmet, I've had at least 5-6 assemblies recast that I know of; And the problem seems to only be getting worse. Unfortunately for me, I still really enjoy researching and making the parts themselves, and it doesn't really make sense to run these at a small scale like I could some of the turned parts. So I will say at this point that at best, if we decide to release these they will be sold until we hit a certain number of them(however long that takes), then they'll be shipped all at once. At worst, these go into a drawer and this just turns into a show-off project that I'll still be really proud of, but won't be willing to share with the community in the current state that it is in.
In talking with some others, I know that I'm not the only one that feels this way. There is a ridiculously accurate ESB flamethrower not being made because the designer doesn't want his work to be copied. There is another person with armor bucks that would put everything else out there to shame, but they haven't released it because, again, they don't want their work to be recast.
I really appreciate the gratitude, Rob. I do have one of the smaller expanders in hand (the one not used on Fett's gauntlets) that I'm going to model. There is a good possibility that I'll release those for the Vader community regardless of the outcome with the large expander.
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MachineCraft
Active Hunter
I have to come clean. The post earlier this month was photos of our first prototype sample that was rejected pretty shortly thereafter. I thought it would make a good litmus test since I realize that as makers, we're a bit more critical of our work than the community typically is.
We still have a fair bit of work to do as the list of processes keeps growing somehow (please make it stop), but below is the latest iteration of production samples that will be about 96% similar in raw part production, and about 50% similar in finishing ops.
Neo Fett
Active Hunter
Good lord those are beautiful. Miles ahead of what I've seen others make and that isn't even the final version? Plus you're actually tapping the hole! I've had some other replicas sent to me to install in commissions and I had to buy super tiny taps and do it myself.
MachineCraft
But are they up to dental standards, ADA's SCDP? Meaning if a dental practice called you to order some, would you sell them to em'?
I jest, but seriously those are super cool, well done my good sir! I'd definitely be in line to grab one myself!
-Iron
But are they up to dental standards, ADA's SCDP? Meaning if a dental practice called you to order some, would you sell them to em'?
I jest, but seriously those are super cool, well done my good sir! I'd definitely be in line to grab one myself!
-Iron
Cantina Dude
New Hunter
This is an interesting subject of concern and would love to hear more about it.
Your offering here would be a replica of a found part that others could also source, measure, and replicate, so it would be difficult to determine if someone was just copying the dimensions from your replica (on the assumption that your replica would be identical in dimension to an original) or were measuring their own example of the original found part. If these were your own artistic interpretation of a custom made part rather than a found part, I can certainly see the concern, but I'm curious if you could elaborate on how you would hope to hold exclusivity over dimensions of a found part that has been publicly known for many years.
If I'm reading between the lines correctly and I understand who the people it seems you are worried about copying your dental expander replica are, does the fact that both of those people have already developed and brought to market their own functional brass replicas of the dental expander not take care of some of your worries? Obviously they didn't copy your dimensions since you haven't actually produced and released your replica yet, so they clearly did their own design work. I'm curious to hear more about what your concern here would be about this specific piece.
I've been dabbling in the found part replication game in the Vader scene so I'm always interested in how others navigate similar waters, so I'd love to hear your thoughts.
MachineCraft
Active Hunter
Not necessarily true. If you are replicating found parts, especially prismatic found parts from the 50's/60's/70, you're probably well aware that tolerance swings can be and are all over the place. During the modeling process, you can choose to accurately model those tolerance inaccuracies, calculate and find an average dimension, or completely idealize the part based on what number is within tolerance for that part that you think they were had originally specified on the drawing (I suppose you can really do a combination of all of these for each individual dimension). If someone is producing a part with modern machining techniques, they're going to hold tolerances much tighter than the original parts, so it would be pretty unlikely for them to land within .001" on a couple dimensions - it would be impossible for them to land within .001" on several dimensions.
I could see the point you're trying to make on a simpler turned part, but this is far from that.
Hold exclusivity over dimensions? I'm not sure how opting to mitigate recasting is holding exclusivity to found part dimensions. You mention the found parts being publicly known for years - yet there isn't one accurate model out in the wild.
To date, the only expanders that have been sold are, to be frank, inaccurate cash grabs. So, do I think that the guy who copied every dimension he could on several of my parts would do the same thing again when it comes time to restock parts that the community now realizes are inaccurate? Yeah, I think that's a pretty fair assumption. He clearly didn't have an actual expander in hand, or his part wouldn't have come out nearly as horrible as it did.
I think I was pretty clear about my intentions - I would simply rather leave this as a passion project than have my work copied. I enjoy the process of making these things; It is an escape for me. I do not enjoy the overall community's acceptance and/or support of active recasting.
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