Seen STAR TREK yet?
- Thread starter Muad Dib
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AFettFullofDollars
Well-Known Hunter
Maybe we could get JJ to 'reboot' the Star Wars Prequels!
hunterofbounties
Jr Hunter
watched it on line last night and was very pleased with it. Was definitely not my fathers Star Trek lol
Sorry to revive this Star Trek thread, but I just saw the film for the first time and I have to say I didn't like it much. Yet another sloppy plot where some bad guy goes back in time to destroy the future. Where have we seen that before? Yes, it is true that many Star Trek films create all sorts of weird logic to make sense of their plots, but after seeing this one I have to ask the obvious -- why do space ships always get to go through black holes and "come out the other side" to return to the past, but planets and supernova are simply sucked up and destroyed? Also, am I the only one in the quadrant who understands that if you intend to destroy a planet with a black hole, it isn't necessary to place the black hole in the center of the planet!? I think anywhere NEARBY will work okay. The problem is, Hollywood thinks the audience is stupid, and apparently they are right because audiences eat this stuff up like the bland coconut-oil-less popcorn they serve at the theater.
Actually, as far as plot lines go, this ranks as one of the campiest yet of the series. And then next to plot there is the problem with the characters and how they all end up promoted to command and senior positions right out of the Academy. Ugh. This film is more of a superhero origins movie in the tradition of Batman Begins rather than anything Star Trek that has come before it. I mean really... Uhura, Kirk and Mccoy all meet in Iowa on the shuttle craft for new recruits? Iowa? McCoy was from Iowa, too??? This movie requires you to switch your brain off, which is a bad place to start if you want to make good science fiction, but again, that raises the last sad point... this is not science fiction. It is just an action flick with black holes and lasers instead of car chases.
I am assured now more than ever that the previous assertion that Abrams is a hack is absolutely correct.
Actually, as far as plot lines go, this ranks as one of the campiest yet of the series. And then next to plot there is the problem with the characters and how they all end up promoted to command and senior positions right out of the Academy. Ugh. This film is more of a superhero origins movie in the tradition of Batman Begins rather than anything Star Trek that has come before it. I mean really... Uhura, Kirk and Mccoy all meet in Iowa on the shuttle craft for new recruits? Iowa? McCoy was from Iowa, too??? This movie requires you to switch your brain off, which is a bad place to start if you want to make good science fiction, but again, that raises the last sad point... this is not science fiction. It is just an action flick with black holes and lasers instead of car chases.
I am assured now more than ever that the previous assertion that Abrams is a hack is absolutely correct.
Star Wars Chick
Sr Hunter
Saw it last weekend and LOVED IT! Best movie I have seen honestly in years. It was everything the SW prequels should have been but were not. I was a fan of Next Generation and of all the Trek movies. This exceeded my expectations. Just saw Terminator last night and I had been anticipating seeing it much more than Trek but did not enjoy it near as much.
MandalorFett
Well-Known Hunter
What is this "Star Trek" you speak of?
Replicant Shadow
Active Hunter
I agree with Mirax statement. As a matter of fact, I am now more dissappointed than ever with how the Prequels ultimately turned out, especially in hindsight. I can only watch Sith now, and I can no longer stomach the TPM and AOTC. It's sad in a way, that Star Trek, of all things, revived the action-adventure-character driven formula that Star Wars and Empire brought to the genre in the 70's. I am going again this week, and I can't wait for the Blu-Ray release.
FoxPrimus101
Jr Hunter
I'm not a huge Trek fan myself but I did love that they took a whole new outlook on it all and this being more of a new movie rather than a prequel opens up the possibility for more Star Trek movies to follow this one.
Darasuum Verd
Active Hunter
Well, I saw this movie not long after it came out, and I loved it. It was well done, in my opinion, and I liked the story. Can't wait for a sequel, because you know they're going to make one.
-Naas
-Naas
oneone1111
Jr Hunter
I'm not a physicist, but I think the reason the black hole device is placed in the center of the planet is to more efficiently destroy it. The planet is a sphere and so is the black hole. Gravity would be pulling inward equally from all sides. The faster the planet dies, the less time the Vulcans have to escape.
I also don't think that McCoy and Uhura are from Iowa. In the bar the other recruits call Kirk a townie. He's from there and they are not. It's just where the shuttle for new recruits leaves.
Obviously, I like this movie. It was entertaining. It requires some logic leaps, but instead of over analyzing I choose to sit back and have fun.
No disrespect intended, just defending my viewpoint.
No disrespect intended, just defending my viewpoint.
No worries, mate.
It's a decent point, but in terms of efficiency, spending time drilling a hole into the planet's core is not going to be any quicker than the extra time needed for the black hole to destroy the planet from the equator. Probably a whole lot less so, in fact, though, yes, it is more visually dramatic (and that's why they did it, not because it was more real, but because it looked "cooler"). It's just a lazy ticking clock device to give the good guys time to do their thing. I am less concerned with the physics and whole lot more concerned with the lousy storytelling. Placing Uhura and McCoy on the shuttle to the Academy with Kirk is still just plain ludicrous, even if they are coming from desparate regions. That seems like inventing a backstory for George Bush where he and Condoleeza and Cheney all met in Texas on the bus going to their freshman year of college. It just makes the landscape of the story so much smaller and silly. But I know why they did it. They did it to compress the character development so there would be more time for that stupid drill to plow a hole in the planet and have more explosions. I can see the story development meeting now... writer #1: So how do we establish Scottie as chief engineer on the Enterprise?
creative exec: There isn't time for that. We need time for more explosions and lens flares. Just put him on the Enterprise and have Kirk talk to him like he is the chief engineer. No reason is necessary. The audience won't care.
writer #2: But what about the fact that he is not even a part of the Enterprise crew when we introduce him? Isn't there already a chief engineer onboard who knows what he's doing? Don't we need to establish Scottie has some authority somehow?
creative exec: What? Come on! His outrageous Scottish accent is his authority! Stop over-thinking. Just think "more explosions." Fast cutting. Lots of shakey cam. Don't you know anything about writing? The audience doesn't care how he gets down there... just have him say his thing about the engines are about to explode and the audience will love it! They'll forget all that other stuff. It's movie magic, baby! Okay, love? Catching on? Now go finish that draft so we can replace you with a new team of writers for the next draft.
:cheers
(This is not an attack on anybody's taste or opinion, just my silly point of view --> merely old data. Pay it no mind.)
I think that the way they introduce Scotty is good. I like that he is given his formula for beaming onto the enterprise while it is at warp speed by Spock Prime. Of course, once he has that information, he would be the more appropriate choice for the chief engineer once on the Enterprise. They do establish that he is a part of Star Fleet and we can only assume that he is more experienced than the previous engineer, because he has his formula at that point and they do not yet have this capability. Once they are back on the Enterprise, Spock doesn't know how they managed to get on a moving ship. Since it is Scotty's formula that allowed something that had never been done before, he would automatically be put in charge of this department.
If Scotty had not developed this ability to beam onto a moving ship in the past, then Spock would not have been able to give him the information, and then Kirk would have never made it back to the Enterprise in time to help with the situation with Nero.
I personally loved this movie and thought that the character development was done well for all of the main characters. I especially loved McCoy. I think it was essential for him to get on the shuttle in Iowa, even though I do not think he was from there. This way we can see how far the friendship comes between him and Kirk. I like that they would meet on their first day and then develop the relationship they had. It makes it more realistic that McCoy would put his neck on the line to get Kirk on the Enterprise since they have known each other since the beginning.
If Scotty had not developed this ability to beam onto a moving ship in the past, then Spock would not have been able to give him the information, and then Kirk would have never made it back to the Enterprise in time to help with the situation with Nero.
I personally loved this movie and thought that the character development was done well for all of the main characters. I especially loved McCoy. I think it was essential for him to get on the shuttle in Iowa, even though I do not think he was from there. This way we can see how far the friendship comes between him and Kirk. I like that they would meet on their first day and then develop the relationship they had. It makes it more realistic that McCoy would put his neck on the line to get Kirk on the Enterprise since they have known each other since the beginning.
I'm getting in deeper than I ever intended, but alas, a few more swings of the blade into the empty air and then I will gracefully exit. Clearly I am in the minority opinion and that pesky studio creative exec is right.
I have no problem with his introduction. That was fine. Frankly I was just relieved he wasn't on the shuttle from Iowa like everybody else.
Did I just say franchise? Oh crud.
Oh, and an aside here: there might be an answer for this I am not aware of, but does anyone know why McCoy is at the weapons console during the Kobayashi Maru test? Did I miss something? He's still just a doctor, right?
Nah, I'm kidding. I'm not going to cry. Oh. Wait. What?
Hey, you know, I personally love Star Trek and I really truly wanted to not just like this film, but love it. Maybe I am just an old fart too stuck in the past. Maybe the reason I don't care for this Star Trek is the same reason I didn't care much for the Star Wars prequels. I'm stuck on the old magic. The new stuff has its own magic. It's a different magic. One that just doesn't speak to me.
Nah. Let's face it. The magic is gone.
I have no problem with his introduction. That was fine. Frankly I was just relieved he wasn't on the shuttle from Iowa like everybody else.
No problem with this either. That is a clever idea to be sure, though it is used rather blandly as a shameless plot device.
The problem is, Scotty doesn't really have this capabiity either, so to make this assumption of experience level is a leap I am not following. Experience comes from actually doing things. Scotty didn't do anything. He was given the formula from some guy from the future. That's not experience. Sure, he may have the experience >in the future<, because that's where he invented the formula, but that's not at all the same as having done it in the present. If a friend of Einstein's traveled back in time and gave him his formulas for General Relativity when he was still just 8 years old, would the 8 year old Einstein then suddenly have the chops to be Lucasian Chair of Physics at Cambridge University? Even if everybody thought this 8 year old did this on his own, would they elevate him right away to top spot, no questions asked? You seem to be thinking so, but I cannot make that leap. You see, the problem is, I WANT to believe that Starfleet can be real within this fantasy world in which this movie lives. I WANT to believe it has real rules and something like a real chain of command where people earn their place through hard work and experience similar to say, how the chian of command in the United States Navy would work. But in this film it feels more like the Somali Pirate Navy, where promotions are had willy-nilly, based on whether you show up with your own AK-47 or a sling shot. Say some pithy dialog at the right moment, BAM, years of working your way up the ladder is bypassed and you are promoted to First Officer. Forget those other chumps in line for the job who have years more experience and are further up the chain of command. As I have eluded to before, when this type of thing happens the character development becomes more like a super hero movie rather than any of the stuff of previous Star Trek films. For example, in every Star Trek timeline before this film, Kirk cuts his teeth as a junior officer on another vessel for several years before given a command of a Starship. Now THAT is character arc. Character development. Something far more believable and weighty -- and in my humble view -- far more interesting. The main characters in this film are just superheroes who only achieve their positions by the entitlement granted them by their character name. But hey, if you like superheroes, then I guess all this type of thing makes sense. I just don't remember Star Trek as a superhero franchise. Pity. I guess I am behind the times.
Did I just say franchise? Oh crud.
Oh, and an aside here: there might be an answer for this I am not aware of, but does anyone know why McCoy is at the weapons console during the Kobayashi Maru test? Did I miss something? He's still just a doctor, right?
You're going to make me cry. I might never be able to walk into another development meeting again. Resistance is futile.
Nah, I'm kidding. I'm not going to cry. Oh. Wait. What?
Hey, you know, I personally love Star Trek and I really truly wanted to not just like this film, but love it. Maybe I am just an old fart too stuck in the past. Maybe the reason I don't care for this Star Trek is the same reason I didn't care much for the Star Wars prequels. I'm stuck on the old magic. The new stuff has its own magic. It's a different magic. One that just doesn't speak to me.
Nah. Let's face it. The magic is gone.
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SarlaccBits
Active Hunter
I was pleasently suprised with this movie... I didnt expect it to be very good going in and I ended up loving it! I thought they did a great job with an ACTUAL STORY! Movies now-a-days seem to be lacking in actual story and charachter development... granted I am a Star Trek fan and was already familiar with these characters... but still. I really enjoyed this movie and hope they continue making ST films of this calibur.
Scotty does have this capability. When Spock Prime gives him his own formula, Scotty had already been working on this for some time. Scotty makes this known by stating that he never thought of space as the thing that was moving.
Secondly, if Spock could just type it in and move them to the Enterprise, I am going to say that Scotty could also. But wait, he did. Who do you think gets Spock, Kirk and Pike back on the Enterprise at the end of the movie. Spock is in his moving ship, Kirk and Pike are in Nero's ship (two different places) and the Enterprise is moving as it is currently attacking when they are beamed back on. Maybe it is just me, but I sure don't think that any other engineer on that ship would have been able to do that. Even Scotty is thrilled that he was able to beam three people from two different targets at the same time.
As for plausability of quick promotions, one Han Solo, the smuggler in ANH, helped the princess escape and gave Luke some assistance in the destruction of the Death Star. In ESB, helped the princess escape again and was then frozen in carbonite. Then in ROTJ, was rescued and suddenly when the plans to assault the imperial base on Endor were being fleshed out, he is a general. The highest possible rank. It was the merit of his actions that was the reason for superquick promotions, just like in Star Trek.
Just my opinion.
Secondly, if Spock could just type it in and move them to the Enterprise, I am going to say that Scotty could also. But wait, he did. Who do you think gets Spock, Kirk and Pike back on the Enterprise at the end of the movie. Spock is in his moving ship, Kirk and Pike are in Nero's ship (two different places) and the Enterprise is moving as it is currently attacking when they are beamed back on. Maybe it is just me, but I sure don't think that any other engineer on that ship would have been able to do that. Even Scotty is thrilled that he was able to beam three people from two different targets at the same time.
As for plausability of quick promotions, one Han Solo, the smuggler in ANH, helped the princess escape and gave Luke some assistance in the destruction of the Death Star. In ESB, helped the princess escape again and was then frozen in carbonite. Then in ROTJ, was rescued and suddenly when the plans to assault the imperial base on Endor were being fleshed out, he is a general. The highest possible rank. It was the merit of his actions that was the reason for superquick promotions, just like in Star Trek.
Just my opinion.
i love you and want to have your babies...I'm getting in deeper than I ever intended, but alas, a few more swings of the blade into the empty air and then I will gracefully exit. Clearly I am in the minority opinion and that pesky studio creative exec is right.
I have no problem with his introduction. That was fine. Frankly I was just relieved he wasn't on the shuttle from Iowa like everybody else.
No problem with this either. That is a clever idea to be sure, though it is used rather blandly as a shameless plot device.
The problem is, Scotty doesn't really have this capabiity either, so to make this assumption of experience level is a leap I am not following. Experience comes from actually doing things. Scotty didn't do anything. He was given the formula from some guy from the future. That's not experience. Sure, he may have the experience >in the future<, because that's where he invented the formula, but that's not at all the same as having done it in the present. If a friend of Einstein's traveled back in time and gave him his formulas for General Relativity when he was still just 8 years old, would the 8 year old Einstein then suddenly have the chops to be Lucasian Chair of Physics at Cambridge University? Even if everybody thought this 8 year old did this on his own, would they elevate him right away to top spot, no questions asked? You seem to be thinking so, but I cannot make that leap. You see, the problem is, I WANT to believe that Starfleet can be real within this fantasy world in which this movie lives. I WANT to believe it has real rules and something like a real chain of command where people earn their place through hard work and experience similar to say, how the chian of command in the United States Navy would work. But in this film it feels more like the Somali Pirate Navy, where promotions are had willy-nilly, based on whether you show up with your own AK-47 or a sling shot. Say some pithy dialog at the right moment, BAM, years of working your way up the ladder is bypassed and you are promoted to First Officer. Forget those other chumps in line for the job who have years more experience and are further up the chain of command. As I have eluded to before, when this type of thing happens the character development becomes more like a super hero movie rather than any of the stuff of previous Star Trek films. For example, in every Star Trek timeline before this film, Kirk cuts his teeth as a junior officer on another vessel for several years before given a command of a Starship. Now THAT is character arc. Character development. Something far more believable and weighty -- and in my humble view -- far more interesting. The main characters in this film are just superheroes who only achieve their positions by the entitlement granted them by their character name. But hey, if you like superheroes, then I guess all this type of thing makes sense. I just don't remember Star Trek as a superhero franchise. Pity. I guess I am behind the times.
Did I just say franchise? Oh crud.
Oh, and an aside here: there might be an answer for this I am not aware of, but does anyone know why McCoy is at the weapons console during the Kobayashi Maru test? Did I miss something? He's still just a doctor, right?
You're going to make me cry. I might never be able to walk into another development meeting again. Resistance is futile.
Nah, I'm kidding. I'm not going to cry. Oh. Wait. What?
Hey, you know, I personally love Star Trek and I really truly wanted to not just like this film, but love it. Maybe I am just an old fart too stuck in the past. Maybe the reason I don't care for this Star Trek is the same reason I didn't care much for the Star Wars prequels. I'm stuck on the old magic. The new stuff has its own magic. It's a different magic. One that just doesn't speak to me.
Nah. Let's face it. The magic is gone.
you are capable of expressing into words my thoughts exactly. i am incapable of doing so because i get so angry (at the person i'm explaining to; that paramount let and encouraged this to happen to their 40 year old franchise; at jj abrahms for taking the job as director even though he had no business doing so; and that now that majel died there are no roddenberrys left to keep trek staying on course) that i can't keep my thoughts straight and it ends up with name calling.
you immediately contradict yourself. spock GIVES simon pegg (that wasn't scotty, that was simon pegg pretending to be scotty. pegg was awful as scotty. it really felt like abrahms was told one day during production that there was a character named scotty on the old show and he said, "WHO?" and after a brief description he eventually said, "well... get another writer and put him in ahhh... here." and he pointed to a random page on the script.) the equation/formula because this universe scotty wasn't capable of making the math work.
first off, none of them were at warp in that scene. second, yes simon pegg did do that, but if someone who already knew the launch codes for americas nuclear weapons told you the codes, you could go start WW3. simon pegg didn't know what he was doing, but he had a great cheat sheet.
the rebel alliance was not a formal military organization. they were guerrilla terrorists. rank structure and advancement operates a little differently in that environment than in a real military. i.e. if han worked for the other side and managed to blow up yavin before luke got his lucky shot in the hole, he would have gotten a commendation on his record, and a GJ from tarkin (who would have taken all the real credit for the defeat of the rebels) and the emperor wouldn't have given two poops about who actually did it. and certainly wouldn't have been advanced in rank to general.
those are my opinions that i have backed with my thoughts.
Well, I stand by my opinion and my thoughts on this movie. Considering that it has got great reviews and made more at the box office than any other Star Trek movie, I am going to assume that most of the public opinion agrees with me.
Even in this very thread, most of the comments are positive on this movie. I think that you are over analyzing the movie. It is a fun and entertaining movie.
By the way, Go Steelers!!
Even in this very thread, most of the comments are positive on this movie. I think that you are over analyzing the movie. It is a fun and entertaining movie.
By the way, Go Steelers!!
never ending fett
Active Hunter
Of what I would consider the big 3 movies so far this summer; Wolverine, Star Trek, and Terminator, Star Trek was in my opinion the best. It prompted me to go back and rewatch all 10 of the existing Trek movies, and I have even started watching the original series, which I had never really watched before. It's interesting to see some of the things in the original series link to things that happen in the films, even this current one; like Sulu fencing LOL. All in all, I would say this film has done what it set out to do; renew people's interest in an otherwise dying franchise, and make alot of money in the process.
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