NEW MR FETT HELMET PICS

Another observation about the casting of the MR production ...

I know it seems petty ... but it does make another valid point.

I compared the calc pad casting the the castings that I make (they came from the same master from Brak's Buddy). Art was kind enough to lend his calc to me a number of years ago before I got my own.

When comparing the "chip" on the board, to the castings I make, it didn't take long to realize that the MR was noticeable smaller thank mine :eek: :eek: :eek: And I was comparing it to a CASTING, which means it has already shrunk negligibly.

The point? well, the cal pad casting that is in the MR is made of the same exact RESIN that was used as their "gel coat" in their casting process. As stated in my post above, I do not believe it to be polyester resin, because it's too flexible. But nevertheless, does this mean that the MR suffered some shrinkage too ? :lol: If something as small as the calc pad casting could shrink that much, what about the helmet? does this mean that the ILM that they scanned is even bigger? Or did they compensate for this by increasing it's size a bit to allow for the casting shrinkage as I proposed above ?

Food for thought

FP
 
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On the calc casting... I know the person that cast mine for MR was not a professional and it was cast somewhat hastily. I can't say anything beyond that because I wasn't there... I just sent the calc upon request. I don't know if that direct casting was sent to mass production or if a casting of the casting was sent or what... I know I was pleasantly surprised and shocked to see the very light scractches I put in my chip were still very evident on the final production model.
 
Okay, after having paid about $500 for a signature edition helmet, I honestly have no desire to go cutting it up to make it more screen accurate. If I wanted to do that, I'd probably just get one built from scratch.

What I do want to do though is correct the pinched mandibles so it looks a little more symmetrical, as well as presentable. The tapering is a little too pronounced for my taste.

Is anyone planning on just doing a simple mod to theirs? I'd absolutely be nterested in seeing the results.
 
Can't complain much when we are talking 1/8in here and mm there. Other than the visor squint and extra "kill" strip, I like mine, much better than the DP Deluxe that I plucked down quite a bit more money on 12 years ago.
Thats about all I got to say about that....;)
Mike
 
OK, since I made the mentioned post, what questions might I be able to answer? I don't have an MR prototype in hand, but I do have the MF and I have access to a prototype. I also know a considerable amount about the original MR work on the helmet.

Also, gonna nix the idea of the MF bust shrinking, especially in the amounts FP mentioned about the ears as too many other dimensions line up perfectly. Shrinkage to that degree would have the entire helmet off and it simply isn't.


Sorry Art, I didn't see this when I posted earlier :lol: I certainly wasn't ignoring you.

I suppose the biggest question for me would be to know if the cad guys at MR compensated for the casting process in any way within any tolerances? It's not a real big deal when you get right down to it. However you look at it, shrinkage, or even slightly larger, it's almost negligible. It's more of a curiosity than anything.

Their casting process is something I'd be interested in hearing about.

The *dent* is a big curiosity too. Any idea what happened between the proto and the production? Is there any way to get a casting of the prototype dent to stick in my bucket since I'm cutting it up ? :lol:

On the Mf bust, not sure what to say there. Perhaps MR altered something somewhere, because the resin RS ears sure don't fit. Perhaps the resin ears shrunk a little from their masters? I kept the RS ears specifically for the MR because i knew the MR ears were just plain *bad*. I'm just trying to figure out what goes to what, essentially, cherry pick what fits best with what :lol:

On the calc pad - that's good to know, thanks. It makes more sense now. I would venture to guess that it was a casting that was sent to them, as there are sure signs of that. There are a couple of components also missing from the board too.

FP
 
I suppose the biggest question for me would be to know if the cad guys at MR compensated for the casting process in any way within any tolerances? It's not a real big deal when you get right down to it. However you look at it, shrinkage, or even slightly larger, it's almost negligible. It's more of a curiosity than anything.

Before I say anything I want to make sure it is understood that this is SECOND HAND info, given to me from someone who worked directly on the Fett helmet project. I wasn't there, so I am only passing on what I was told or what I have seen in photographs.

It is my understanding that very little was done to the realscan with only the typical corrections that apparently are required for any scan. There was no purposeful upscaling or changes made. I know that there were issues with the dent, the keyslots, the triangles, etc (see a pattern in the problem areas) and that MR had to go back and take additional pics of the PP3 of these areas. Interestingly enough, each of these problem areas appear to be a bit off to me... perhaps it is because they took a bit of artistic licensing with the correction of those specific areas. MR had considered cleaning the helmet or even making it symmetrical as was originally done to the stormtrooper helmet. However, I, and others, pushed for NOTHING to be changed and to the best of my knowledge, nothing was purposefully changed or cleaned. Clearly the realscan didn't capture every nuance of the original helmet (I think people have the wrong impression that real scan technology is far more advanced and sophisticated than it is) and I am sure even the minimum cleanup that was necessary might have took away other nuances (yes I used that word twice because I can't think of another word to describe such subtle details).

I was told that a professional propmaking company in CA made the prototypes. I don't know how they were made. I don't know if a foam block was carved from the realscan data and then a mold was made of that or what. I saw and held one of at least two prototypes made by this company. If was the best and most professional fiberglass prop I have ever seen. It was absolutely flawless. Note... I did not say anything about accuracy...

The prototype I saw was painted by Jason Eaton (and I believe shown here at TDH) and then repainted by Rogue Studios. Rogue Studios also painted the second ptototype. I don't know what happened to those prototypes. I don't know what was used for production and any guess would be pure speculation. Rogue Studios MIGHT know more but I am not sure as his input was focused on the paint and weathering.

The two things that stood out to me regarding the prototype (aside from the stunning fiberglass work) was that the helmet was exceedingly crisp and compared to the MF, exceedingly clean. I had tell-tale warps here and there, but overall it lacked all the subtle (here it comes again) nuances that the MF contains. I don't know if the realscan didn't pick those up or if they were sanded out of a foam prototype or what, but while the MR maintained the warps and curvatures of the original helmet and no doubt came from one, it felt very sanitary. Perhaps I only say that because the MF has so much characetr. I was stunned when I received that helmet, and was more stunned when I went back to the original pics and could match up all the "trashiness." I honestly believe most people, especially the public at large, would not want such a helmet because they would consider it ugly and unrefined. The MR stands in stark contrast to that with a very smooth dome and very clean lines.

The *dent* is a big curiosity too. Any idea what happened between the proto and the production? Is there any way to get a casting of the prototype dent to stick in my bucket since I'm cutting it up ? :lol:

I only have the MF in hand. I don't know what happened to the dent, but clearly, as can be seen with Lee's abandoned paintwork, changes were made after our involvement ended...

On the Mf bust, not sure what to say there. Perhaps MR altered something somewhere, because the resin RS ears sure don't fit. Perhaps the resin ears shrunk a little from their masters? I kept the RS ears specifically for the MR because i knew the MR ears were just plain *bad*. I'm just trying to figure out what goes to what, essentially, cherry pick what fits best with what :lol:

I can't speak to any of this because I don't have the RS cast ears or the MR production helmet. I can't explain the discrepancy.
 
I just received my helmet (thanks Dark Shadow!), number 254, and MAN DOES THIS THING STINK!!!!! IT SMELLS HORRIBLE!!!!!!!!!
Lol.
They pretty much all reek of fresh paint when you first open them.

Put it somewhere well ventilated for a little while and the smell will dissipate.

I agree though. Wearing it's almost like sticking your head in an empty paint bucket. :p
 
Before I say anything I want to make sure it is understood that this is SECOND HAND info, given to me from someone who worked directly on the Fett helmet project. I wasn't there, so I am only passing on what I was told or what I have seen in photographs.

It is my understanding that very little was done to the realscan with only the typical corrections that apparently are required for any scan. There was no purposeful upscaling or changes made. I know that there were issues with the dent, the keyslots, the triangles, etc (see a pattern in the problem areas) and that MR had to go back and take additional pics of the PP3 of these areas. Interestingly enough, each of these problem areas appear to be a bit off to me... perhaps it is because they took a bit of artistic licensing with the correction of those specific areas. MR had considered cleaning the helmet or even making it symmetrical as was originally done to the stormtrooper helmet. However, I, and others, pushed for NOTHING to be changed and to the best of my knowledge, nothing was purposefully changed or cleaned. Clearly the realscan didn't capture every nuance of the original helmet (I think people have the wrong impression that real scan technology is far more advanced and sophisticated than it is) and I am sure even the minimum cleanup that was necessary might have took away other nuances (yes I used that word twice because I can't think of another word to describe such subtle details).

I was told that a professional propmaking company in CA made the prototypes. I don't know how they were made. I don't know if a foam block was carved from the realscan data and then a mold was made of that or what. I saw and held one of at least two prototypes made by this company. If was the best and most professional fiberglass prop I have ever seen. It was absolutely flawless. Note... I did not say anything about accuracy...

The prototype I saw was painted by Jason Eaton (and I believe shown here at TDH) and then repainted by Rogue Studios. Rogue Studios also painted the second ptototype. I don't know what happened to those prototypes. I don't know what was used for production and any guess would be pure speculation. Rogue Studios MIGHT know more but I am not sure as his input was focused on the paint and weathering.

The two things that stood out to me regarding the prototype (aside from the stunning fiberglass work) was that the helmet was exceedingly crisp and compared to the MF, exceedingly clean. I had tell-tale warps here and there, but overall it lacked all the subtle (here it comes again) nuances that the MF contains. I don't know if the realscan didn't pick those up or if they were sanded out of a foam prototype or what, but while the MR maintained the warps and curvatures of the original helmet and no doubt came from one, it felt very sanitary. Perhaps I only say that because the MF has so much characetr. I was stunned when I received that helmet, and was more stunned when I went back to the original pics and could match up all the "trashiness." I honestly believe most people, especially the public at large, would not want such a helmet because they would consider it ugly and unrefined. The MR stands in stark contrast to that with a very smooth dome and very clean lines.



I only have the MF in hand. I don't know what happened to the dent, but clearly, as can be seen with Lee's abandoned paintwork, changes were made after our involvement ended...



I can't speak to any of this because I don't have the RS cast ears or the MR production helmet. I can't explain the discrepancy.

So what you're saying Art is that you have a really sweet copy that is really close to the real deal and you're sending me a copy tomorrow??? :lol:;)...huh huh?

I think what you've said answers the two of my Biggest questions, and just tells me that the "drop-off" occured at the MR level......again. :facepalm... "At what level did it go from an actual movie prop scan to a production version??" "Or was there no Drop-off?.. and was the MR production equal to what we've come to know as the "standard", in this case the MF, or now even more so the MR proto and now things just don't match???"....which would in turn open up a whole other can of worms.
Again I'd say MR messed it up IMO.:(..what a shame.

The MR Proto looks a hundred times better, IMO!!!(y)...so jealous.
 
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I only have the MF in hand. I don't know what happened to the dent, but clearly, as can be seen with Lee's abandoned paintwork, changes were made after our involvement ended...



I can't speak to any of this because I don't have the RS cast ears or the MR production helmet. I can't explain the discrepancy.

After looking and measuring, I can say for a fact the MR is larger in almost all measurements.
 
I want to see a comparison of the MR prototype with the production piece.
If the proto is better as I have suspected it is, then I think a little black market work with silicone is in order.

Its not like I'm just whinning because I dont have a proto (I AM but thats beside the point.;) ) Its not like an authentic cast that someone tracked down and bought.
MR made it for everyone to have. Im not too keen on having a new group of elitists, however unintentional it is.
 
I want to see a comparison of the MR prototype with the production piece.
If the proto is better as I have suspected it is, then I think a little black market work with silicone is in order.
MR made it for everyone to have. Im not too keen on having a new group of elitists, however unintentional it is.

I am not sure I fully follow you, but we don't have the prototype helmet. Those were painted and sent back to MR.
 
The MR Proto looks a hundred times better, IMO!!!(y)...so jealous.

I am not sure I would say it is 100 times better, but pretty much like any prototype we see anywhere, the prototype is usually better looking than the final product... it is just an unfortunate but apparently inherent result of mass production.

While we don't want to give MR a pass on this, I also think it is important that we don't blow things out of proportion, as is so often done, and that people begin to look at the MR production helmet as worthless. It isn't. It is light years ahead of its predecessor and an amazing achievement in mass production. No, it certainly isn't 100% spot on accurate, but show me one that is. While I won't hail the MR helmet as the pinnacle of helmets, it is a great helmet and anyone should be proud to own one.
 
Thanks for all the info Art ! That does make a few things "click" a little better in my head :lol:

I sort of had a gut feeling that the MR proto was a better helmet too, long before the production came out. You could see the dent already washed out in some of the "later" toy fair pics.

Whoever still has a casting of the MR prototype should pony up :lol: BUT, is certainly not obligated to do so - I understand that ;) But If that individual decides to step up (publicly or privately), I'm officially offering my services :lol:


As far as the production helmet goes ... I'm thinking I'm done with it. I made the one mod for someone else out there that will appreciate it, and will put it up in the cargo hold at a significant discount since it has been altered. But I've come to the ultimate conclusion (this is just "MY" opinion alone) that the MR production is just a $400 Mystery Helmet :lol: Okeefine, a little better, but not enough to justify the cost :p

FP
 
I am not sure I would say it is 100 times better, but pretty much like any prototype we see anywhere, the prototype is usually better looking than the final product... it is just an unfortunate but apparently inherent result of mass production.

Okay well maybe 99.5% better ;)...:lol:

Just saying that untimately with todays technology that a "scan" of a Prepro 2 in this day and age...to me (IMO)...is better than anything else out there, hands down....and should now be considered the new standard.(y)

All Hail, the MR PROTO!!! (y).....:p
 
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Personally, I think the MR helmet is well worth the cost for most collectors. However, if you are striving for greater accuracy, the price point is hard to swallow for a helmet that would need to be taken apart, cleaned up, modified, completely repainted and reassembled. When you can get a casting of the Mystery helmet for around $100, it is hard to justify over 4 times that for an MR. I keep hearing people say MR missed the mark, but I maintain that for a mass produce pieces, they did an amazing job. The problem is, most of us aren't mass-produced kinda people. If we were, I am not sure there would be a need for this board to exist. I think perhaps some people's expectations might have been a bit too high for a piece that we all knew, from day one, could never meet our expectations or be exactly what we want. We are far too picky and meticulous to be satisfied with that. However, for what it is, I think the MR helmet is a success and a marvel.
 
I am curious to see how many other people like myself are getting the runaround from MR and are still waiting for their helmet to ship. I have called three times only to be told it will ship tomorrow. On one call I was told they are only shipping 50 per week and on Fridays. They promised me that mine would be in the "next group" and of course it was not. I ordered the SOB practically the very second it became available to purchase directly from MR website.

Two days ago I received an email stating there had been a communication/shipping error and that the LE helmet/giclee would be shipping witihn two weeks. My eamils to them go un-answered. I called about canceling it and was told it was two late amd the only way was to refuse shipment. This is the fourth, and I promise you, the very last MR purchase I will EVER make. (n)

Sorry if this slightly off topic. I would love to be sitting here trying to critique this helmet with you fine people, but for some reason MR does not think I'm worthy. Thank you for all of the wonderful opinions and pictures (Fettpride, Braks, Spidey) and ideas on trying to improve this. If I ever get mine, I think I will try the easier visor fix. I can live with consequence of the mandible shifting slightly, however the 10 mm difference in the visor taper reall bugs me. Cheers!:cheers Jason
 
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