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  1. Member Since
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    May 14, 2005, 10:15 AM - casting-, modeling- Materials? #1

    Hello from germany guys,

    I am happy to be able to use this great forum.

    I am looking for a Material to cast my helmet off. Is a mixture with flour of the wood and a wood-glue a good idea?
    What different Materials are preferable. What do you use?

    Marcus
  2. FettTheHunter's Avatar
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    May 14, 2005, 9:12 PM - Re: casting-, modeling- Materials? #2

    Hi or goodantalk ( clearly my German is appalling )


    I've not done any molding and casting myself yet but I think silicone rubber is the standard mold making material, If you have not already got it there is a very good book on the subject of mold making and casting called ..The prop builders molding and casting handbook .. by Thurston James.

    Randy
    :jet pack
  3. Darth Mule's Avatar
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    May 14, 2005, 10:44 PM - Re: casting-, modeling- Materials? #3

    Yes. Thurston James has a plethora of wonderful instructional guides for these kinds of things. I wouldn't use that wood flour mixture on a helmet. You might end up with just a big mess to clean off of your bucket. www.smooth-on.com is where I get my mold-making materials. If you order a starter kit, it will come with your mold rubber, liquid plastic, release and sealing agents, and a small instructional guide. Silicon is the preferred mold rubber for casting something like a helmet. From smooth-on I recommend the rebound 25 brushable silicone rubber. You measure it by volume, so you won't need a scale and a trial size should cover a helmet. You would also need to pick up the proper release agent. Silicone is good about not sticking to anything, but it's better to be safe when covering your bucket with goo. Have a look around their site. They have pretty much everything you'll need. One thing tho. Just keep in mind that plasticene clay with retard the curing process of the silicon.

    -Chris
  4. Member Since
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    May 15, 2005, 8:04 AM - Re: casting-, modeling- Materials? #4

    Thank you I will buy this book immediately
    Is the silicone rubber material good to use as a mold for vacu forming?
    The first step is to cast it off and after that I want to vacu form it. Or would it be better to make a fiberglass helmet?
  5. Darth Mule's Avatar
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    May 15, 2005, 11:42 AM - Re: casting-, modeling- Materials? #5

    Vacu-forming is a completely different animal. Tho, you wouldn't vacu-form the silicon, you can still cast the helmet in silicon and pull a plaster positive from the silicone mold. I recommend a gypsum/plaster mix as it is a harder cast and less likely to crack under the pressure of vacuum-forming.

    I myself would recommend the fiberglass option over the vacu-forming. The vacu-form would have to be done in two pieces, which is always a pain to reassemble. You can do the fiberglass in one piece. It is much easier and produces a stronger product.

    Stronger still, and easier to work with. My personal preference is resin casting. The very same plastic you get from the site I listed in the previous post (www.smooth-on.com) I use the smooth cast 300. It is cast in much the same way as the fiberglass, but it has far less fumes, and easier to work with in all respects. It's less gunky, so it's easier to spread around the cast. You do have to keep it moving untill it sets tho, or it will pool up and harden.
  6. Member Since
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    May 15, 2005, 12:55 PM - Re: casting-, modeling- Materials? #6

    hmm ok gypsum plaster. What could this be in german ..is it a mixture with water in it? Isnt it shrinking after casting off? sry my english is limited
    But anyway... are there any more alternatives to gypsum plaster?
    Although fiberglass could be a better way I am interested in vacu forming because I eventually can use a manufacturers vacuformer! Therefore I need a good mold or is it called form?!

    thx

    Marcus
  7. MARROW SUN's Avatar
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    May 15, 2005, 8:54 PM - Re: casting-, modeling- Materials? #7

    What sort of helmet are you casting?
    Vajranoid said:
    Hello from germany guys,

    I am happy to be able to use this great forum.

    I am looking for a Material to cast my helmet off. Is a mixture with flour of the wood and a wood-glue a good idea?
    What different Materials are preferable. What do you use?

    Marcus
  8. Member Since
    May 2005
    Posts
    6
    May 16, 2005, 8:43 AM - Re: casting-, modeling- Materials? #8

    Its a stormtrooper-helmet from thin styrene. I am not casting it yet. I need the right materials to make a mold and later vacuform it. I am totally new in this hobby without much experience. I am happy to get any tips and tricks
  9. MARROW SUN's Avatar
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    May 16, 2005, 1:01 PM - Re: casting-, modeling- Materials? #9

    Did you make the stormtrooper helmet yourself? Or did you buy it from someone else?
  10. Member Since
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    May 16, 2005, 1:59 PM - Re: casting-, modeling- Materials? #10

    Its selfmade. Is this necessary for the casting process?
  11. Member Since
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    May 16, 2005, 4:00 PM - Re: casting-, modeling- Materials? #11

    please let us with the topic remain. Are there any other kinds of clay or something?
  12. Jaiden's Avatar
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    May 16, 2005, 6:25 PM - Re: casting-, modeling- Materials? #12

    I made my own Fett helmet out of the cheap modeling clay that doesn't harden. I found it in the craft section at WalMart. If they don't have them in Germany, just look for a local craft store that carries it.

    For the casting, bobamaker had a great idea with paint-on silicone for the first layer, then butter-on for the second. This gives you the best impressions of detail.

    You could also check out Polytek. It's a company in Easton, PA, USA that specializes in silicone for casting.

    Good luck.

  13. Darth Mule's Avatar
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    May 16, 2005, 7:24 PM - Re: casting-, modeling- Materials? #13

    Vajranoid said:
    hmm ok gypsum plaster. What could this be in german ..is it a mixture with water in it? Isnt it shrinking after casting off? sry my english is limited
    But anyway... are there any more alternatives to gypsum plaster?
    Although fiberglass could be a better way I am interested in vacu forming because I eventually can use a manufacturers vacuformer! Therefore I need a good mold or is it called form?!

    thx

    Marcus
    Gypsum is just a harder plaster. We use a brand called "Ultra-Cal" and since it's more expensive than plaster, we usually add it to the plaster mix to strengthen it. But, Yes you will need a good model to Vacuform over. If you're doing a helmet, you will probably have to do it in two pieces, or you'll never get the form out of the plastic.
  14. MARROW SUN's Avatar
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    May 16, 2005, 9:22 PM - Re: casting-, modeling- Materials? #14

    I just find it odd that if you had the skills to make a styrene stormtrooper helmet, that you wouldn't know how to create a mold for vacuum forming?!

    Isn't the helmet you have vaccumformed styrene?

    Vajranoid said:
    please let us with the topic remain. Are there any other kinds of clay or something?
  15. Lord Maul's Avatar
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    May 16, 2005, 9:32 PM - Re: casting-, modeling- Materials? #15

    I think that MARROW SUN is just trying to watch out for you since there is a very accurate Styrene helmet that as far as I know is one of the only Styrene ones out there. And recasting is a very touchy subject.

    And as a helmet maker (and a damned good one from what I've seen) he just wants to make sure everything is in order.

    It's very good to post pics of what you have to avoid any recasting accusations that may come up.
  16. Darth Mule's Avatar
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    May 16, 2005, 11:10 PM - Re: casting-, modeling- Materials? #16

    I don't really see a problem with the recasting aslong as you aren't making a profit off of someone else's work.I know several people who have gone in on a helmet as a group and recast it so they could all have one. Nobody sold anything for profit. Just people getting together to ease financial burden.
  17. Jango_Fett_Jr's Avatar
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    May 17, 2005, 8:07 AM - Re: casting-, modeling- Materials? #17

    NOPE.
    http://www.thedentedhelmet.com/showthread.php?t=7184
    Darth Mule said:
    I don't really see a problem with the recasting aslong as you aren't making a profit off of someone else's work.I know several people who have gone in on a helmet as a group and recast it so they could all have one. Nobody sold anything for profit. Just people getting together to ease financial burden.
  18. E2K13's Avatar
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    May 17, 2005, 2:26 PM - Re: casting-, modeling- Materials? #18

    Darth Mule said:
    I don't really see a problem with the recasting aslong as you aren't making a profit off of someone else's work.I know several people who have gone in on a helmet as a group and recast it so they could all have one. Nobody sold anything for profit. Just people getting together to ease financial burden.

    The government told Napster that it wasn't called sharing. They called it stealing and shut them down too!
  19. Darth Mule's Avatar
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    May 17, 2005, 6:50 PM - Re: casting-, modeling- Materials? #19

    And notice the words "and sell them" at the end of every statement. So no offense fellas, but personally, I see nothing wrong with replicating something you have purchased for your own use such as recasting your Boba Helm for your Jango costume. Don't get me wrong, I am against profiting off of someone else's work tho. It's a thin line, but it exists. Saying someone can't recast something in their own home is an invasion of privacy. It doesn't become a public offense untill you sell.

    Then again, I could be wrong. Just my view.
  20. MARROW SUN's Avatar
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    May 17, 2005, 8:15 PM - Re: casting-, modeling- Materials? #20

    It says pretty darn clearly,
    1. Do NOT copy another member's work.
    I guess your free to do whatever you want in your own home but I doubt with your view on the matter anyone from the community would now chance selling you anything anymore.
  21. Darth Mule's Avatar
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    May 17, 2005, 11:57 PM - Re: casting-, modeling- Materials? #21

    First off. Don't get your panties in a wad just because someone has a more lenient view on a topic than you. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. And there's no reason to go making threats about my status as a buyer on this board. This is the kind of attitude that spawns abortion clinic bombers. It's childish and stupid. If you want to argue a point you don't do it by throwing a tantrum. I'd love to hear the other side of the argument, but so far none of you have attempted to type a civil paragraph on the matter. Let's be civil. I love the TDH and I'm sorry if I offended anyone. But I'm open to listen to your views as well. Hell, you might have a compelling argument that could change my mind on the subject.
  22. E2K13's Avatar
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    May 18, 2005, 12:52 PM - Re: casting-, modeling- Materials? #22

    Darth Mule said:
    First off. Don't get your panties in a wad just because someone has a more lenient view on a topic than you. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. And there's no reason to go making threats about my status as a buyer on this board. This is the kind of attitude that spawns abortion clinic bombers. It's childish and stupid. If you want to argue a point you don't do it by throwing a tantrum. I'd love to hear the other side of the argument, but so far none of you have attempted to type a civil paragraph on the matter. Let's be civil. I love the TDH and I'm sorry if I offended anyone. But I'm open to listen to your views as well. Hell, you might have a compelling argument that could change my mind on the subject.
    I think my comment was cival.
    I used the Napster example which can sum it up perfectly.
    Napsters excuse for being able to transfer and download songs and media VIA a free shareware service was determined to be stealing. Their argument was that they were "Sharing" the media with others so it wasn't technically stealing because there was no profit involved. The lawmakers determined that even though they weren't making a profit, they were damaging the original artists by taking the profit of their labor away.
    The issue of recasting is clear that if you spend the time to sculpt, research and produce a final product, you are hopeful that someone will buy it from you because that is the way you intend to share it with others. Nothing hurts more then when you produce a superior quality and accurate product to show up at a convention and find a bunch of people walking around in poorly recasted versions of your helmet you never authorized the production of. That happened to CloneSix. Now, the prop community has lost one of the best helmet and armor producers due to the fact that he refuses to make them anymore because it will just end up in the wrong hands to be recasted again.
    If you can't afford a superior quality helmet, attempt to make one yourself or save your money until you can afford that one you originally wanted. Otherwise, your only selling yourself short.
    Last edited by E2K13; May 18, 2005 at 2:35 PM.
  23. Darth Mule's Avatar
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    May 18, 2005, 6:28 PM - Re: casting-, modeling- Materials? #23

    Thanks E2K13. I understand completely. I don't mean to come off as defending recasters. I definitely find it more than a little unscrupulous to profit off of someone elses work. As far as the sharing bit goes, I can see your POV, but I also see why people would do it. So, I guess if anything that brings me more to an ambivelant standpoint on the issue. So, when in doubt I'll have to side with the artist. My personal area of expertise is more with the soft parts of a costume. I'm an experienced cutter/draper and stitcher working in a theatrical costume shop, and things are a little different with clothing. You just need some good pictures to reproduce someone's backbreaking effort on a garment. Which is what we here on TDH have done with our favorite bounty hunters. So, you could say my world is a little more loosely governed.

    And just in case anyone is wondering why I'm so familiar with recasting methods. It's because we do it all the time at work. You have fifteen characters wearing the same medallions, jewelry, or whatever. You learn to recast your pieces to stay under budget. I've recast my teeth twice for two different severed heads. Not really all that interesting I guess, but I have a great recipe if anyone ever wants to carry their dismembered head around for halloween.

    Again, I apologize if I offended anyone. I'm not here to make enemies. Quite the opposite actually. And we have so hijacked this thread. Bad us.. Oh well. ROTS tonite baby!!!
  24. Jan 22, 2006, 6:44 PM - Re: casting-, modeling- Materials? #24

    speaking of the starter kit from that website, does anyone know how much resin, etc comes in it? i checked the website but it just says whats in it, does anyone know how much exactly of each thing? thanks.
  25. Jan 28, 2006, 8:44 AM - Re: casting-, modeling- Materials? #25

    Coubughmp, ahem

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