Whoa, what leather are you trying to figure, the skirt or the laces, er..confused.
Discussion on Making the skirt within the Zam Wesell Costume forum, part of the Star Wars Prequel Trilogy Bounty Hunters category; Whoa, what leather are you trying to figure, the skirt
Whoa, what leather are you trying to figure, the skirt or the laces, er..confused.
1)I wanted to know Area wise for the skirt squares - i tried to work out how many square feet of leather needed for the actual skirt squares and it went terribly wrong
2)On a seperate thing i wanted to know how to cut the lace. I would have thought using a thickness of 1/4 and cutting 1mm strips in a spiral would work at first - the lace would then be straight. But the surface of the thonging i would want to dye wouldnt be smooth and cutting 1mm strips is near impossible. Cutting it the other way 1/4 strips on a 1mm hide in a spiral would make the lacing not straight - does this matter? How did you do it?
For the skirt squares, you only need a single shoulder (or double shoulder if you want to use the rest of the leather for other purposes). Actually a double shoulder of veg tanned leather is better if you intend on making a belt, a single shoulder may not be long enough. It shouldn't be more than 18 sq. ft. I think.
On the laces, no no no, 1/4th inch is the width of the strand. 1-3oz is the thickness of the hide. The laces could be made from 9 square feet of leather, probably less. It's NOT straight. If you purchase the leather lace tool, it comes with instructions on how to use it. It spirals cuts from in to out, makeing a loooong piece of lace. Read this thread over again, I don't think you are getting how leather works. You can't understand it until you are in a shop touching the vegetable tanned leathers and the tools. Goto www.tandyleather.com and read over the frequently asked questions. I don't understand what you mean by thonging?
Thonging is lace Nearest good leather shop is 200 miles away so i wont be touching anything unless ive already bought it and had it shipped LOL.
Thanx for the areas
And don't forget LOTS of extra blades for the lacemaker tool!
Man... I'm still practicing and not getting the laces near long enough... 9 sq feet?!? I think I'm gonna need a whole herd of cows to make enough leather for my lacing!
Those poor nauga hides... (other thread joke).
Yeah,a 9 sq ft. hide if you cut from inside out, then you should come out with enough lace.
This pic was wiped off somewhere, for the actual squares and a look at the columns. And, I only had 15 going across I think, not 16.
So, each column should be about 11 feet of lace give or take how tall ya are. Therefore, you would have 1 strand = 11 feet. 17 columns x 11= approx 187 ft of lace. So, we should cut give or take, about 62 yards for the skirt, I think. I somehow remember cutting around 85 yards for some reason. Oh well, better have more than less, cause once you cut a column's worth of lace then the rest of that lace is discarded if it doesn't equal 10-12 feet. I once figured it using 2PiR or 3.14xdiameter somehow. I felt so smart.. and my brain hurt like nuts, but I had 3 strands left over, I was that close! 2 x 3.14 x 12inches (which is a 2 ft circle)would give you like 75 inches of lace for just 1 time around that width. I won't sacrifice my brain again... I'm sorry, I can't give you anything exact. But even a small 2 ft circle would give you TONS of lace.(2ft circle is 4 sq feet of leather used) But yeah, like 9 sq. ft should be enough (so that you can cut a 3 ft circle). So long as you are practiced enough. And don't forget to tug on the back of the strand once you get it started. It will help lots.
11 feet!!! *runs screaming* Aaaarrghhh!!!!
Zam I Am wrote:
But even a small 2 ft circle would give you TONS of lace.(2ft circle is 4 sq feet of leather used) But yeah, like 9 sq. ft should be enough (so that you can cut a 3 ft circle). So long as you are practiced enough. And don't forget to tug on the back of the strand once you get it started. It will help lots.
Still haven't managed to get anything longer than about 3 feet before the blasted thing cuts.... All I can say is that if I run out of hide before I have the lace, I'm gonna just buy the pre-cut stuff ... even though all I have seen isn't as wide as it should be!
Last edited by MaulMaus; 06-23-2007 at 11:58 AM.
Well i cant find Lexol in the UK atm
I read youre little tutorial and it says put the lexol on the lacing but it doesnt say put it on the squares. Do you need to do the Lexol application on the squares also?
Nope, cause it doesn't matter if the squares are hard, just the laces need softening. If the lace is too rigid, it becomes difficult to pull it through the holes.
I was watching the Last Samarai and George Lucas was a big fan of Japanese kirosawa films, I wonder if he got the idea of the Zam skirt from Japanese samarai armor. http://horse.shrine.net/samurai/jinmu_e.html
It may have, but we all need to recall that Zam was first a concept drawing for the clone troopers look and that idea is rumored to have been lifted from a Japanses Anime. And a lot of Anime has clothing and armor styles that take from Samarai era clothing And Armor.
Hmmmm.... sounds pretty good to me! So much of the Star Wars universe is taken from Japanese cultural history - it doesn't surprise me. Good eye!
I just remeasured and I came out to 9 feet of lace per column. But, again, that is the conservative side, assuming that the laces are tight. I would air on the side of caution and make 10 feet lace strands per column. I just found a way to lengthen my skirt FINALLY.. a mistake on the my skirt has paid off . I realized rummaging through my piles of leather, I had cut two more rows of squares by accident, and it was already dyed the same color. And, I had left over lace predyed, so all I have to do, is unlace my skirt and seal the other pieces that were left out, and just have two knots in the back of the skirt. I can also make another belt, cause it just gets hidden by the cumberbun. It won't be exactly 15x12, but at least it will be longer. Eh, 15 columns x 14 rows ain't bad. Definately, make your squares 2 1/4th" to 2 3/8" tall. It should yield a 21 1/4" tall skirt (laced) with 15 columns and 12 rows.
Hey Yippee!!! I FINALLY got the lace thing down! Even managed to get one 15 feet long! *grins*
I dunno... I just sat down to try it one more time... in peace in quiet mind you... and it worked! I can't believe it... gotta go out and buy a lottery ticket now!
Not to mention the backache!
Yeah... gotta admit I'm pretty proud of myself on this one! Perserverence paid off! Once I finish getting all that lace cut, I get to experience the joy of dyeing all those strands and little squares, holster parts and other miscellaneous stuff!
I'm getting there... I'm getting there!
Amazingly, I've made some progress on this costume Albeit I did cut out the skirt squares and dye them a couple months ago, we're getting ready to lace it and I'll put up some pics soon.
Also, I thought this forum could use a little boost We're slowly working on other parts too, so hopefully I'll have more pics of that stuff also ( ... no not the bodysuit...still no word on that :evil )
Here are a couple pics until I can take more:
Last edited by MonCal; 01-18-2005 at 12:23 AM.
Hey Very Very COOL!
I'm looking forward to seeing it when you get it laced up! Did you actually match up the various darker/lighter squares according to the pics? *yikes!*
I've got about 2/3 of my skirt squares dyed. Ran out of dye at that point because I didn't follow ZIA's advice on how much dye to make! *cringes* Have my lace dyed, but it came out too light, so I have to re-dunk it all... :/
I didn't actually match up the different shades ... exactly I tried to get a decent random affect similiar to the pics. I also added some scratches and blotches. All the squares are the same shade of dye ... and yes, it did take a lot!!. Some are dunked for the dark brownish ones, a few are dobbed and most are airbrushed at different intensities.
We got the lace cut and dyed tonight. Will have to wrap it around a piece of cardboard for the resolene next and finally get this bad boy laced up Here is the lace hanging and dryin:
Here are the laces wrapped around a piece of mdf, sealed and ready to go:
Wow, lookin good. Looks like we're about on the same page here. I've been working on the skirt for the last couple days myself. It's one of the few things I can do in the house, when I can't get out into the shop. I've got it half laced-up so far. I still have about another four hours of lacing, and it's DONE !
Now I gotta get them gauntlets finished.
Made some more progress today
Geez, it takes about an hour to lace three columns. 5 left... so a couple more hours to go:
Last edited by MonCal; 01-12-2007 at 03:40 PM.
Whatever you do, don't cut off the top laces down to a knot until you are sure about the length of the skirt against her leg. That's where I made my big mistake. At least you could just add another set of squares if it isn't long enough. But, everything should pan out cause you made the squares 2 1/4- 2 3/8" tall. right?
Yeah, I did make them a tad taller for that reason and it does fit pretty well.
I can't even believe this. I could put my head in an oven right now .... (not really) .... However,
These pics are a little rushed and crummy but..
Can anyone see what is wrong with this picture? :
If not, then I know it'll pass the best criticizm out there
If you can, I'll have to make a decision.............
Last edited by MonCal; 01-12-2007 at 03:42 PM.
If you're talking about the upper squares overlapping the lower ones, I wouldn't sweat it much. I had to double check the ref pics to be sure, myself, so I doubt anyone would notice. I think it looks awesome, and drapes really nice.
YUP!!! ding ding ding ....... THat's it!!!!!!
I can't believe it. I guess I assumed it'd be like everything else in this world where say ... water could shed off of it???? I think the costume builder screwed up
I'll save that for a future upgrade if it still eats me up and I want to spend about 10 hours unlacing and relacing.
You're right though. Only the eyes in this forum would catch it.
Sigh, I feel your pain man... but, it's no biggie, not like me screwing up the with the wrong neatsfoot oil and having it too short... no one will notice. I had too do a ref pic look up too. It hangs really nicely! I am glad you gave it so much slack so that it wouldn't sit funny like mine.
How many feet of leather were needed for the skirt? Anyone remeber guys?
It seems i already asked this 2 years ago haha!!! Ignore me sorry!!!
Right im just attampting to make a test skirt out of craft foam lol. I hate to think what this is going to turn out like!!!
Thanx MonCal youre a star!!! I didnt get around to finishing my test skirt yet ive only cut the strips so far, we have been working on the rifle
Thanks so much for fixing your photo links MonCal! They really help.
OK, I think I am getting another headache! Here are my questions after reading this thread just once (I know I need to read again).
1) Reference was made to patterns for the skirt. Does anyone have them? I see the discussion of sizes for the rectangle/squares but no photos of patterns or precise patterns.
2) Reference was also made to some lacing patterns, but photos for those are also gone. Can anyone help with that?
3) Dye recipe. ZamIAm said the forumla was in an above post but I can't find it. So what dyes are you guys using, what mixes, concentrations - etc?
I may have questions about cutting laces later. I'm not sure if I have that 100% clear. I need to take a breather.
If you could let us know what post number the missing pic is from it might be something one of us can either replace or post a new reply with the pic. I probably have about every pic ever posted here
Sorry, I just don't have time to re-read the entire thread again right now. I'm pretty certain there was reference to a skirt pattern at the very beginning - but I don't know if that was e-mailed around privately or what.
In post #65 reference is made to "DCB's Diagrams". He has a few posts but it is hard to know exactly which posts have photos missing (I don't get red X's in my browser). I do know that some sort of skirt layout diagrams or lacing diagrams were mentioned and photos are missing in posts #45 & #62 by DCB.
As for the Dye formula, I'd doubt that was a photo. But I read over page one twice and couldn't find it. Just this quote from ZamIAm in post #81 when she was asked about how she got her colors to look so great she sais she used the "forumulas I said above...". Maybe she edited the info out to keep it a trade secret
Kay Dee, I think I was posting and testing so much, I might've written the formula on another thread. But, I could be wrong. It was years ago, and honestly I may have lost the formula. I think that they may have had more dye on some squares and less on others anyway. Due to some residue spots on MOM photos, I am guessing that you can dunk dye some of the squares to get that blotched effect. There is one "back skirt" shot from MOM? or skirting danger files of the starwars.com photos that help you see it. I think it was sealed with resolene, but I don't think now that they used atom wax on it. After looking at some MOM shots ~ dsc04228, the weathering just takes on a whole new technique or actually ~ less technique ~ it looks more raw and dusty, not shiny/waxy.
Last edited by Zam I Am; 01-12-2007 at 09:50 PM.
Well, do you remember what brand and colors of dyes you started with? I'd rather use something others have tested and are known to work if I can I don't mind playing with dipping, air brushing, daubbing from there forward. Or, I guess I can just pick up red and blue dyes from Tandy and start mixing.
All were tandy's dyes. I was told fiebings and tandy's are exactly the same. Good ol' search... works every time... http://www.thedentedhelmet.com/showt...ighlight=skirt
Although this is not my Forte, I love to see the progress on this message board. Great stuff yall!
Yikes... you're making me go back through my piles of stuff! I wrote down my base coloring on the back of one of the scraps of leather - but it's kinda hard to read now. It was fairly close to ZIA's if I remember correctly.
1 1/2 tsp Cordova
1 1/2 tsp Red
2 1/2 tsp Blue
2 tsp Purple
4 TBSP Solvent
I know it seems like a lot of blue/purple - but there is a reddish/yellowish tint to the leather used on the skirt. I did end up altering it some more as I went along, but I dont' remember exactly what I did... I'm sure I added more solvent as I went along though - and probably a bit more Cordova ???? Be sure to check the tone of the dried piece against a scrap of the fabric - nothing can clash like purple tones if they are off! Once you find a color you like you can vary it by applying more or less to each piece of the leather, several layers or whatever.
I'm gonna have to get some pics posted of the pieces I've finished to show you what I mean on that.
Also I used an airbrush to apply the dye - but I think it could be done with daubers or dunked and still look good. Just be sure you mix enough dye to do the whole skirt... not that I would know about having only 1/2 a skirt done or anything...
This is a picture of that piece of leather (complete with other dye splotches) next to a piece of the fabric and a sample of the vest color I was trying to use on the lambskin.
This picture shows what a difference you can make by varying how much dye you put on the leather - it's all from the same dye batch, just with the darker ones I went over it heaver with the airbrush and perhaps a second or third time.
Last edited by MaulMaus; 01-14-2007 at 09:20 PM. Reason: To add a couple of images.
Thanks so much MaulMaus! Hum, I'm not sure if I will want to mess with airbrushing. But if that is the only way to get them to really look good then my husband is going to have to stop babysitting his beloved airbrush!
I will say one thing, not having enough dye mixed the first time for a Zam skirt isn't as bad as not having enough dye mixed for 20 yards of fabric that must all look like they came from the same dye lot! At least the skirt has a patchwork feel to it!
I hear you on the testing, matching, letting things dry - etc. Although mixing leather dyes is slightly new for me, I've been mixing dye for fabrics and mixing paints to match them for a few years now - so I feel pretty good about this! I Can't wait for things to fall in place for this costume and work on it.
I airbrushed most of my squares but to get a variety I dunked some of the squares and I dobbed some of the squares as well with the cotton applicator.
Last edited by Zam I Am; 01-26-2007 at 04:21 PM.
I was having problems with the daubers causing streaks and so I ended up using an old t-shirt to apply an initial coat. Then I went over it with the dauber to get the variations in color.
IMO, It's best to airbrush it first, to get an even coat, then dauber to get the variations. If t-shirt works- then awesome! Or, you can just dunk it and sit the pieces up in a way that lets the dye bead up on the bottom correctly. Kinda like how there are certain skirt squares with an extra amount of blotches on the bottom from MoM photos. FUN with tools~if ya have em.
I measured how long the skirt should be on me and we divided it up and i must have the shortest legs ever. It works out my squares are LESS than 2"
Did you find there was much of a problem with overlap on the length after it was constructed? Should i make it longer than needed or go for the right length straight off the bat?
No, there is a big difference in overlapping. That's why my skirt is too short. I forgot to add the overlapping. I just divided it up like you did, and it ended up being too short. How tall are you? I am 5'5 1/2" Almost 5'6" like Leeanna.
Kathy is 5'1" and I made here first skirt with 2 1/4" squares. It hangs a little lower but it still looks good. I just finished cutting another batch of squares for her new skirt and I made them 2 1/4" tall again
Color coordination stinks though. I still haven't gotten that right. I just use the standup a reference. But, matching paint and leather dyes including wet look vs dry and what's already "given" is so terribly painstaking to a point that you almost don't care if you do it blind folded after so many trials. Waiting for something to dry or cure, that's THE most annoying part.
I keep on forgetting that you are doing zam 2.0 also!
I guess I have to measure an overlapped piece and multiply it by row and then subtract it to the total of a column of 2 1/4" pieces.
Let's see 2.25" x12 (rows)=27"
Overlap = .5625 (9/16") x11 (rows)=6.1875"
Actual size (Cardboard cut out) = approx 20"
Hmm, off by almost 13/16" of an inch. That's ok I guess. If you have a little more overlap on some pieces, it would even out?
At 2" squaress I was shorted by 2 inches and all I ever hear from my hubby everytime we do an event, is "It's too short" Ugh.
Last edited by Zam I Am; 01-31-2007 at 01:30 PM.
Ok guys i was looking for a punch and it seems quite hard to get them here but i found this, now im not sure how good it will be or even if it will work but i thought it was worth a try It was on Ebay as " FISKARS Hand Punch - 1/4" Rectangle " Ill see if i can fit my leather in it and how well it punches but im thinking it might break pretty quickly, anyway we shall see *fingers crossed haha
Just thought, if it breaks ill pull the punch off and stick it on something else and use it as a hand punch with a mallet
Last edited by Langsuir666; 04-26-2007 at 08:36 AM.
Ok due to the squares overlapping and everyone being same height or smaller than me and making squares 2 1/4 im gonna go with that. So just before i try out my strap cutter for the first time .... all strips that you cut first should be 2 1/4 inches? Is that right? Im scared to cut it LOL
Ok i couldnt wait i just HAD to try it!!!! lololol Its like a hot knife through butter!!! I cut a 2 1/4 strip - im wanting to cut more!!! LOL
HEALP!!! Where has the lacing diagram gone to ?! I cant find it anywhere and ive tired searches Im sure i saw it yesterday!
Last edited by Langsuir666; 04-26-2007 at 10:15 AM. Reason: Itchy Fingers
I'm pretty sure the squares get larger as the go down.
Also remember - the bottom squares should slightly overlap the top squares (like fish scales)
Yeah they get wider but the height stays the same. Im just getting really stressed because i can see my lines for the widths arent perfectly bang on straight. Driving me up the wall, what did you guys use to cut the strips into sections?
Oh - I didn't know they stay the same height! Good to know!
I guess they used scissors to cut them!
Yep... Height is the same, Width is bigger as you go down the skirt.
I used a rotary cutter and a metal straight edge. First I drew out directly on the leather where I wanted to cut, then I cut using the rotary cutter. Whatever didn't cut the first time with that (which did happen because I used 7 oz. leather) I used an X-Acto knife to finish the cut. It went very fast that way and because I made only relatively small cuts at a time, they were straight.
once i had my strips of leather cut all the right height, I used a cardboard template to cut it into widths for each size rectangle. it worked out pretty well
Ahhhhh rotary cutter , see i dont have the right tools LOL!! I tried with various type of blades and kept getting little wobbles where the blade was bending so i just used the strap cutter again, they look ok i think
Yeah all cut out now - hopefully they are ok
Problems i got now it the cutter i bought is no good, wont cut the holes and the lace is too thin - its 1/8 not 1/4
I know you can get the hole puncher through mail-order here in the US. I got mine through Montana Leather I think. You might find it slightly cheaper somewhere else. If you do a brand search (I can't think of the name right now and I'm late for work ) you should find a dealer in the UK. I think I paid $40-$50 for mine. It wasn't cheap!
On the lace... I ended up with some of my own and some I just bought... I'm mixing the two up when I finish lacing the skirt. I couldn't rationalize buying a whole new skin just to make my own lace...
I'm in the process of getting my friend to take a look at what the shirt involves to see if he can make it for me and how much he's going to charge.
I just can't see myself getting the time to do it by myself
OK, I hate to be a thorn in everyone's side. I've read these forums over and over and I just get confused, but I have some questions, that have probably been answered...but...:
1) what are the sizes of the squares pre row? I know they stay the same hieght, but what about the width?
2) What type and thickness of leather are you using for the squares and how much do you need?
3) Do you make the laces or buy them? What color are they before they are dyed - or are the pre-dyed?
4) Do you airbrush them with leather dye or is it just fabric dye?
Again, sorry - this has probably been discussed already...
Ok ill have a go! hehehe!
I have the list as follows. 192 squares in total. Square height 2 1/8 - 2 1/4 dependng on your height.
Widths top 3 rows (48 squares) = 1 1/4.
Next 1 row (16 squares) = 1 3/8.
Next 3 rows (48 squares) = 1 1/2
Next 1 row (16 squares) = 1 5/8
Next 3 rows (48 squares) = 1 3/4
Next 1 row (16 squares) = 1 7/8
Lacing can be hand cut from veg tan leather, i think you can also buy lacing like Maulmaus has. Laces are 1/4 flat lacing. Suede lacing is no good to use it has to be leather. You need approx 70 feet of lacing if you cut your own approx 9 sq feet of 1oz.
Skirt Squares are made from aprrox 4oz leather - i used less than skin ill find the footage shortly. Approx 18 sq feet
Dying can either be done with a cloth/dauber, dipping or airbrush. i think most have used a airbrush
Okay... dug out my papers.... on what I used.
5-6 oz. leather for the skirt. (I don't know how much - I had to buy a whole skin in any case).
1-2 oz for the lacing - which also got used on other projects. I didn't have enough to do all the lacing because I'm a lace making-idiot. Hence, I had to buy some lace rather than a new hide just for the lace. The best I found was 3/16" natural lace from Tandy (I think it is Kangaroo skin) comes in 25 yard rolls that can be dyed at the same time you dye the squares.
15 columns is what I think we came up with and 12 rows. Depending on your size you may need to add/subtract a column or row. Here is the link to the oblong punch. http://www.montanaleather.com/osbornepuches.htm. You want the 1/4" Oblong Punch.
I cut all my squares 2 1/4" tall.
Widths (I actually measured in metric - this is as close as I can get it in English/American measurements)
2 Rows: #1: 1 3/8"
1 Row: #2: 1 5/8"
2 Rows: #3: 1 3/4"
1 Row: #4: 1 7/8"
2 Rows: #5: 2"
2 Rows: #6: 2 1/8"
2 Row: #7: 2 1/4"
The pattern called for 3 rows #7 - but I cut it wrong... It's worked out okay for me in any case!
You must use Leather dye on the leather... There is no formula because each skin is different. (I think there is a basic one somewhere on the forum here - but it is only a start) You will need Purple, Cordova (Red) and Blue along with the extender at a minimum. From there you will need to experiment and see what works on your leather. I also ended up using black and brown in my mixture - though very very little of each.
You can either airbrush, or dunk or use the swabs - it's up to you how you want to do it. It'll be messy and stinky no matter how you do it though!
Last edited by MaulMaus; 04-27-2007 at 10:51 PM. Reason: I'm an Idiot who can't count! ;)
heres our finished skirt. Pretty happy with what we've achieved but there are some obvious flaws. Using a thin leather has caused the squares to 'bubble' and therefore not as flat/rigid as seen in the ref pics. it was a weigh-up between getting the right weight of leather or using a hide that was already the right colour, so we went with the latter. For the holes we simply used a round punch, but a much smaller hole and punched it twice to make an elongated hole - you cant really tell unless you look closely I also used a kangaroo skin lacing, bough a 50m roll. I'd also suggest a leather lacing needle.
MM! Thanks so very much!!! :thumbup
I am confused (which you will find that to be nothing new) by your dimesions, there are only 11 rows. Also where is this pattern you speak of...?
Again thanks for clarifying!
Chansplace - Looks good overall, but I see your point on using thinner leather.
Because I can't count! (I'm tired - it was a long day ... )
It was actually 1 row on size #6 and 3 rows on size #7. I cut the same number of #6 and #7 so I had to make the same number for each row.... The pattern I'm referring to is one ZIA and DCB came up with a few years ago and posted here on the forums - I don't know if it's still up or not. But, it basically illustrated the skirt and the sizes they cut the squares (which is slightly different from mine).
MM i have a reel of 1/8 lace from Tandy. I was thinking about going smaller than 1/4 maybe like you did to 3/16 but how did you find it lacing through 1/4 slots, it doesnt make the lace lose does it? Last thing i want is for the squares to be moving around
I have enough squares finished to make a partial skirt (Yeah... I was an idiot and didn't make enough dye to finish all the squares at once... ) I took that along with me to FIDM to check the color against the real Zam. I was happy.
No, the 3/16" wasn't too loose and in fact, I had to really work at it to get it through the second time. If you've already opened the lace, you could make like a test run, see how it works for you - I just think the 1/8 might be too thin and then be loose in the holes - especially the sides of the skirt where there is only the one strand.
Well i think we are going against convention punch, lace and hole wise!!! LOL
We are burning the holes in with a soldering iron and they are 3/16 holes with 1/8 lace. I couldnt get my hands on a punch this weekend and we are gonna get started - wish me luck! hehe
Good Luck! You are going to need it using a soldering iron!
Its actually going quite well, just using a screwdriver attatchment on the iron and it burns the right size slots, then just file off the really cooked bits and its looking good! hehehe
Hope you don't set off any smoke alarms or anything!!
Anyone, dying these squares is a hit and miss nightmare. Most have worked ok though
Did anyone use a weak solution bath soak (I think this will be best) and am I right in thinking if we wet/damped the squares first it would help with the blending on the sqaures, 'regardless' of how you put the dye on.
Is that right and has anyone done that?
*Best Captain Jack impersonation* "Welcome to the World of Zamming Luv"
I did use a weak solution when I dyed the squares - though I used an airbrush. I just went over the squares several times. Some more than others to get the variations of color.
I'm working on our new skirt now and am very happy with the dye color I'm achieving.
I first decided on which squares I wanted to be darker and a little more brown. I chose the darker pieces of leather from the row, mixed a bit of the purple dye with more brown and more solvent. Then I dobbed those squares. I'll mix up some more alternate color for the holster and chest and belly leather. Then for the rest of the squares I dobbed a few of the pieces and airbrush the rest using varying consistencies of dye. Once all of the leather is dyed I'll use resolene to finish it.
Oh.. I'm using 6 - 7 oz leather for the skirt, holster, brim
That is looking good MonCal!!!
It always amazes me how we each come up with our own ways of making these things... And they almost always turn out looking really good! Mine is usually much more messy though! Maybe I shouldn't mention the lovely Zam purple stain I have in the middle of my garage floor now eh?
So you have a roadkill zam grease stain in your garage now huh?
Here are a couple pics in real light. A word of the wise... USE NATURAL DAY LIGHT when making your colors. Never ever trust your indoor lighting. It's actually better if it's a bit overcast or in the shade.
In my opinion these books are the best for color representation and the dressing the galaxy book is the closest to my neoprene that Yvonne had made. Plus I prefer those colors the best out of all the reference photos
I don't recognize the top left book in the middle picture... I'm shocked I don't know that book... but I don't. What is it called? Yep... I love the Dressing the Galaxy books! Not only for Zam Reference but for all the fantastic costumes!
Thanks Tony. I'm very happy with the colors this time.... much closer than our first skirt ....... and you can bet I'm gonna lace it the right way this time
I worked on getting the color for the holster, which turns out to be a 3 stage dying process to get the hi-lights around the raised portions. If I have time tomorrow I'll dye the holster and share the process for that one.
The other book is the chronicles book
Now just hear me out here LOL
Looking at Zam's skirt for hours and also reading up on how leather is dyed until I'm blue in the face I think maybe we've been doing it wrong?
I think the leather sheet was stained/smudged/soaked (that's how the side parts of each square look pink/purple)
I think it may have been dyed/soaked and then cut up?
Soaking the leather or making it wet helps the dye to travel throught the leather and help it blend correctly.
That's why each squares tone/half tone etc looks like it 'belongs' to a larger smudge and looks more natural?
What do you think?
Moncal, looking cool. When you dye yourt holster do you make it and then dye it or dye the pieces then make it?
Ive tried dyeing the squares as you say, i put some in the water over night but they have dyed really really dark, its hard as the water dilutes the dye but it just acts as something for the leather to float in so the same amount of pure dye still sticks/transfers to the leather.
Proving very very hard to get the color, dilution and time correct. Then when i do get it right i would either have to keep each one the same and do it per square or try to work out how that dilution/mixture relates and transfers to working with a whole hide and find something big enough to put the whole thing in.
Rubbish pics but heres an idea of whats comming out - really hit and miss at the moment.
Bee that camera has a flower symbol on the left hand side of it
Press that and it allows you to focus on things close up.
Press it again to go really close up.
Apart from that red one they look ace to me!
Yeah i couldnt find that button LOL - thanx
I put the red one in to show how varied they are with just a little change in the dye.
I gotta say these look good and i think John may be right, Im experimenting with a blue and purple bath atm
Last edited by Langsuir666; 05-01-2007 at 07:03 AM.
Um.... why are you soaking them in water?
I just mixed up my dye solution tested, tested and tested till I got the right color on my leather and then airbrushed the squares. By going over them 1-2-3 times I changed the lightness/darkness of the squares. You can do the same by dunking or using those brushy thingies (Okay... I'm tired... up with a sick kid all night )
I just made the dye mixture really diluted then I could also make some parts of the square darker if I wanted with the airbrush.
Interesting effects though...
The skirt panels need to be dyed, front, back and 'sides'
As I looked at the skirt I noticed that the sides were paler than the rest. So I guessed that maybe the leather was dyed as a whole hide and then cut up into the panels.
I thought the only way the edges would be pale and the backs coloured is if the dye soaked through it. I still they think rubbed the dye onto the surface but the leather being wet helps it spread out.
I just thought if we used water it helps the dye to spread evenly (even if you do airbrush people suggest to dampen the leather first to help it spread)
Plus if you have as leather sofa and you want to do home repairs the kit tells you to dampen the leather.
Think of people painting skies with water colours. They put water on first then the paint. Same principle here. Just makes it look more 'naturally' coloured
Just my 2 pence anyway
Hope your nipper gets better
Last edited by sl/tk8456; 05-01-2007 at 08:47 AM. Reason: typo
Right What ive done here is stick water in a container, add a few drops of each color (ive tried a few combinations). Then the leather is dunked right in straight to the bottom and held there so the little air bubbles come out and it will sink. Ive left some in for about 8 hours and some only for 30 mins Ill post up in a sec some of the effects ive got.
I dont think it would work on a whole hide as it doesnt permeate through the whole of the skin, just the sides back and front but it does create a beautiful soft natural looking finish, i have to say i was dubious because i liked my airbrush squares but if i could get this the right color i think it would look lovely.
Anyone spot the potential danger in this photo, oh yeah
Yeaaaaaah if youre gonna be dying things PURPLE dont put an old glass full of dye next to the blackcurrent cordial, yes i did try and drink some - no i didnt swallow it - luckily LOL
Few more of the testing colors here
Last edited by Langsuir666; 05-01-2007 at 10:06 AM. Reason: Added pics and Public Safety Warning
Buy a cheap plastic washing basin thingy and go nuts Bee.
Get a ratio right with that pipette thing. (lovely word)
Transfer that to the basin, fill it up (add the same amount of drops again) and test one.
If it comes out cool dye lots and lots of em
The 1st purple one on the left (maybe the 3rd one in), the funny shaped one on the bottom and the totally punched one looking totally rocking!
No, no, water! Water, when it dries your pieces will make it stiff like a rock! And, always cut first dye afterwards, cause you won't get any on the sides of the squares. Just dye and use denatured alcohol as a solvent! You can buy tons of this at any hardware store.
yeah you might be right about the water drying them out, but what if you nourish the leather afterwards with moisturisure. Should help it return to a more flexible thing?
Becky tried to dye more but made the mistake of getting the colour wrong and adding more colour.
Word of warning to anyone trying that...only thing that'll happen is it'll just go a darker colour