I think I'm being scammed... Does anybody recognize this suit/pics as belonging to anyone but a member named Butters. Any help is much appreciated.
Thanks,
Shawn
Discussion on Does anyone recognize this suit/pics? SCAM? within the Boba Fett Armor forum, part of the Star Wars Original Trilogy Bounty Hunters category; I think I'm being scammed... Does anybody recognize this suit/pics
I think I'm being scammed... Does anybody recognize this suit/pics as belonging to anyone but a member named Butters. Any help is much appreciated.
Thanks,
Shawn
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=160190274323
http://www.thedentedhelmet.com/showthread.php?t=23106
Thats the helmet and boots that he claims were his... Anyone know those?
so you're assuming somebody used someone elses photos to make it look like he is "selling" them!? wow.
Thats what I'm thinking, yes...
I saw those pics on ebay too. If thats what the're doing thats just rude. have you tried contacting them about it?
Which pics? The armor, JP, and EE3... Or the boots and helmet?
what the heck has this world come to man?
i saw all of that on there im pretty sure.
also... the blacking out of the face on the one picture? trying to keep who it is unable to be identified maybe? idk.
Yeah... Its weird as hell... I'm waiting until Paypal decides on the claim, and if I don't get my 100% of my cash back, I'm filing criminal charges against the owner of the Paypal account. One way or another, I'm getting my money, or goods, or getting someone a felony conviction. He/they decided to rip off the wrong person.
Yeah, I saw the thread about that new guy, and I was sorta iffy on em, especially the way the guys face is blacked out on that one pic.
I hope everything goes alright Devilstar, good luck with your refund!
-Naas
Thats chest armor almost looks like SPF. Almost, not saying it is.
Well, i would think the blacking out of the face is very similar to anyone else here not wanting their face shown with their armour.
Now, a smart person just crops the pic, and doesnt black it out. Much simpler.
Heres the best thing you can do in the future. Dont send money from your BANK ACCOUNT, send it from your CREDIT CARD. With the bank account your at pay-pals mercy, and if he has removed the funds, your out of luck.
Its a lot easier to dispute a credit card claim. And the credit card company will do the dirty work of filing a fraud claim usually.
It was a cc... Waiting to see what happens with Paypal first. Plus, I don't think it qualifies as fraud to the cc company, because the cc pays Paypal, then Paypal pays him.
Originally Posted by Devilstar2k2
Not true...you can still do a chargeback on your CC. I've done it before. Usually the CC company will want details on the fraud and then they will rule in your favor and you'll get your money back. Paypal HATES it when you do it though, so use that method of recovering your money VERY sparingly.
I just called Mastercard... They need me to fill out a form and fax it in. :sigh:
What I really want to happen is for the stuff to show up on my door step, and then I can look like a jerk... A jerk that got a good deal on some stuff... lol... Such a pain dealing with this ****. I knew it stunk when I bought it, but it was a great 'deal', and the guys story kind of checked out. I mean, theres no way that he'd get away with it if I pressed criminal or civil charges, so I don't understand whats going on in his head. Seriously, it'd be two felony counts. Lets hope for his sake that I recover every dime; otherwise, I will press charges.
Thieves suck.
So what happened exactly?
Tell me you didnt just ask that...
Basically, I paid on the 31st... He said he would ship the next day, and send me a tracking number. Then I never heard from him again. Even after repeated posts, and PM's. I also stalked him through user profiles, both here and on the RPF. He has been online at both sites, with PM's and posts, and he hasn't responded AT ALL.
I've been over every scenario in my head... and can't think of a single excuse for him. All I can come up with is that he needed money so badly that he just doesn't care if he gets caught or not. And he will get caught - I paid to a verified Paypal account.
I know that it hasn't been that long... But the lack of communication and shady nature of the deal is enough for me to bag it before too much time passes. I paid him $560, and he can't even respond with a tracking number? Thats enough in my book to say that something is up.
EDIT-
Oh... and he had originally tried to get me to send a money order. This is the first and LAST time that I will buy anything from unestablished member... Unless they send the goods first.
Last edited by Devilstar2k2; 02-11-2008 at 09:03 AM.
I got a basic understandning of what happened - I just wanted the full story - he must of posted about it before, but I missed it.
Devilstar - that really sucks. I hope you get either your items or you money.
Theres your proof that he needed money then. If he has a verified paypal account and told you to send him cash, then..whoa just lost my thought. oh yeah. if he said send him cash even tho he has paypal, he was trying to just get the money, and spend it on whatever it is he was trying to get and then there would be almost nothing for you to do about it.
(p.s. High School Mac keyboards suck)
I actually sort of have 3 threads running on it... His sale thread, a 'favor' thread in the sarlacc pit, and this one. Its kinda hard to miss... lol... :P
He says its his 'room-mates' Paypal ID.
thats a load of ****! haha
this is why ebay sucks. any jack-... that wants to rip people off can and will do so by hijacking photo's for a false sale just to take your hard earned bills.
good luck getting your money back. make sure this loser learns his lesson
Sorry to hear that.....
Good Luck
Alfredo
You can escalate the claim with PayPal so you do not have to wait the (10?) days or whatever.
PayPal will only give you what he has in his account. If his account is empty... you get NADA!
"IF" PayPal returns only a portion of or none at all, get the Dispute rolling with your credit card. It is easy to do.
As Foxbatkllr said, your CC will get your money back. I've had to do it and got the money back no problem. And yes, use it sparingly. If you file too many chargebacks PayPal will close YOUR account!
ALWAYS fund PayPal payments with a credit card! Doing it that way gives you "Real" protection!
I called the cc company and they said they would email me the form... But I never got it... So... I have to call them again.
Yikes! What happened with Devilstar??
I'm guessing it was the MOW Gauntlet thread from yesterday....
Yeah, he said some pretty nasty things (swearing like a preacher for lack of a better term) to members, as well as TDH
FP
Dang...I missed the conclusion of that thread. I stopped posting in it after it was clear I wasn't telling him what he wanted to hear. I was trying to be reasonable and objective. Oh well.
i somehow had a feeling it would end up like this
I know I was reading that thing all afternoon! Then Poof it was gone!
Oh well.
Hope he gets what he wants.
I've dealt with Devil a few times, and he has always been helpful, patient, and informative. I'm sorry to see that he is gone. What can you do, he had been taken for quite a bit of money and wasn't happy with the quality of an item he received. It's unfortunate that it snow balled the way it did.
I stopped reading yesterday around 5ish. I kept seeing a new post like every few min. and didn't bother reading any more. what was he saying? I mean, i saw where he was coming from, but i wouldn't have made such a fuss about it. what got him banned?
yeah I gave up on reading it/trying to help too.
alls I was trying to do was tell him a way we fix stuff around here in similar shape just in case he didnt get a replacement... so he could fix and maybe throw on ebay :/
but he turns into just attacking people trying to help so screw it.
yeah he's spent a lot of money recently... but honestly 400.00 for gauntlets that arent metal is a bit high anyway if he was as tight on money as he says. alas.
I feel for the guy, but he's been a bit of a jerk in a lot of the posts he's in lately.
Umm... not cool, since he can't respond..I feel for the guy, but he's been a bit of a jerk in a lot of the posts he's in lately.
sorry, and the post he did it in is gone too, so you're right, not fair.Umm... not cool, since he can't respond..
banned for it is punishment enough.
What did he do to get banned ?
all I've seen was expected venting...
I thought the staff makes an announcement when someone is banned and tells why?
I haven't seen anything yet.
The reason is posted now and it's only a 7 day ban
Not that I amount to a hill of beans on here, I just lurk a lot, but I personally know devil and yes he has spent a load of money on Boba gear recently. His financial situation gives him one time a year to spend money on the things he wants and that is tax time.
He had heard that they where great from many people so he gave them a chance and other than the major crack he liked them and was just asking for an undamaged piece, much like you would do if you went to a store and bought something for a large amount of money, just to find when you got it home that it was broken. Everyone of us would take it back to the store to get it replaced not fixed but replaced.
He had been ripped off of $500 from butters and to his mind $400 again with the gauntlets, where the damage is on them would be very hard to fix if at all possible and paying $400 for them he had expected to be able to use them.I feel for the guy, but he's been a bit of a jerk in a lot of the posts he's in lately.
I know of many things he has bought to almost complete a boba or jango tax time after tax time just to turn around and sell them because he needed money, if someone had an issue with what he sold them he ALWAYS took care of it. Even though he does nothing more than paint a lot of the items he bends over backward to help his "customer" and just expected the same in return.
Anyway in a 2 week period of time he is out (or could be considered out) $900 I think that would upset alot of people, did he get hot headed, yes he did, did he deserve a ban according to the rules of TDH , yes and he is serving it without much of a complaint but take a moment and look at it from where he was coming from 2 weeks almost $3000 in Boba parts from the community here, of which $900 was lost. He was told by many members to suck it up and consider it a lesson learned. OUCH tough lesson.
Ok back to your normally scheduled bounties and BTW I love TDH even if I don't post much.
No one told him to suck it up. I know I read the whole thing. Members gave him options and sugguestions. I never once read anything that sounded like, Too Bad so Sad..
Last edited by 99centTaco; 02-15-2008 at 11:01 AM.
tazrob, not to get into the same argument with you as it was headed with Devil, but the issue was, a bunch of us were trying to help him, assuming he COULDNT get a replacement. we all wanted him to be able to get his money back... but if he couldnt, we were offering solutions to help him maybe fix the crack then sell the gauntlets to get some of his money back. we didnt so much want him to suck it up, well, not I, I just wanted him to have an option of getting 300-350 of his money back by ebay.
if you are in this long enough you lost money somewhere. its unfortunate but it happens to a lot of us
as for the money thing, i too have little to throw around. other than the Kids around here, I probably make less than everyone else. which is why i have to look hard at what I buy and why I went with the gauntlets I did that look darn good for 1/4 MoW especially after digging around to see I wasnt that thrilled with MoW for the price.
I still hope he's able to get something out of it... as I posted in that thread, there are a LOT of people selling stuff waaaay overpriced who dont care about their work now-a-days or their costumers. see us as a meal ticket, cause those who have huge disposable incomes can throw money at them
I am not here to argue with anyone, Its all good I just did not want to see a lynch mob develop AGAIN, lol. Taco you still working on Jedi belts?
I think this is actually a really important thing that not a lot of folks think about...
We're used to that mentality. We buy something at Target, it's busted, we bring it back, and all is well.
The thing to remember is that while it's cool when a hobbyist does that, it's not really *required* of them, since there are no rules to govern our illegal passtime. Word of mouth / reputation is really the only governance.
We *expect* that level of service, but really shouldn't.
To that end, I'm really clear about things when I sell stuff that I make. As-is, final sale, no returns, if you're not happy sell it to someone else, but I don't want it back. If people don't want to buy from me, that's fine.
Anyway, I think it's a good lesson to us all that we need to remember that the established framework of retail sales does not necessarily apply in the hobby realm.
and generally, large ticket items, if opened, you dont get a new one, you have to send it back to be fixed. happened with x-boxes recently. you send it in to get it fixed, they didnt always send ya a new one. sometimes the retail store you bought it at will take it back, but not always. especially with electronics.
I still hope Devil sends it back and gets them fixed or is able to resell them.
Why *shouldn't* we??
as a seller, I'd be worried someone would have decided they didnt want the item, or found a cheaper option, and is breaking it on purpose to get a refund.
not saying that happened here, as it seems obvious DS had a bunch of people in the same boat as him with that particular seller...
but thats why I never got into large expensive things, I only make small things and cloth things, mostly Rebel costumes. as if someone decides they dont want it, its not gonna be broken and sent back to me. and I generally dont make a large profit anyway.
I think we should be able to get that level of service for props, but I certainly dont expect it anymore
both sides of our hobby is a bit dangerous unfortunately
that is the part that I think shouldn't have gone ignored. MOW really had no response to any of the comments about consistency in his product and I'm sure everyone would have liked to hear his side of the story.
Unfortunately, I think with Devil's ban the message that came across was that negative comments towards sellers were not allowed or not taken seriously.
and to take it a bit further, I know this is more of an independent market and not big box retailers, but why shouldn't we expect great service from TDH sellers?
I mean aren't we all here to help each other out anyways? I mean i'm sure every seller likes to make profit on their work, but if we're really thinking about money wouldn't it have been better to just replace the gauntlet for Devil?
Devil probably would have just started a thread, like most members do, commenting on how accommodating MOW was in the transaction and how no one should hesitate to buy from him? Even from a business standpoint it makes more sense. All it really turned into was people telling him that he should have bought from Wickedbeard or that they had similar problems with MOW's product.
Last edited by Clan_Skirata; 02-15-2008 at 06:32 PM.
Why *shouldn't* we??
because the sellers are under no *obigation* to provide it.
i guess i overly simplified that... it would be nice if we could expect it, but it's the seller's call whether they provide it or not.
i've bought stuff from awesome people and **** people. i tell folks my experiences as they happen, and leave it at that.
this isn't the first time that mow has been called out on support issues. when i've been asked about him, i say that his stuff is great when it comes all correct, but if you have an issue, his support is lackluster.
just like durasteel/partsandtechnical.com... HUGE pain to deal with, but awesome awesome stuff when you finally get it.
so i don't want it to seem that i'm defending mow or anything.
i'm just saying that i'm never surprised when someone stinks to deal with. when someone IS great to deal with, it's a great thing, but i don't expect it.
maybe it's just a cynical attitude, but i almost expect to NOT get what i paid for most of the time.
i'd like to take this opportunity to speak to the above issue, as it simply is not the case.
Devilstar was initially banned because of the manner within which he chose to handle the situation with MOW. As I stated to Devilstar, I was sympathetic to his situation, and especially in light of the fact that he had so recently been taken advantage of, sadly, by "Butters". Devilstar violated the CoC through the repeated and pervasive use of profanity and through a lack of respect for the members and admins of this forum. It was not the fact that Devilstaf was dissatisfied with a Seller, that is your perogative, however, it was the manner within which he chose to express his dissatisfaction, i.e. the use of profanity, etc.
It is not our intent to curb discussion of available Fett parts and makers, quite the converse. However, as with any topic to be discussed herein, the discussion must be consistent with our CoC. Simply stated, while its ok to be frustrated, and, yes, even angry on occasions, there are ways to express that in a manner that is mature, and, moreover, within the confines of the CoC.
Devilstar's ban was made permanent due to a completely unrepentant attitude and further transgressions in private conversations with the Admins. It was unfortunate, mostly because it was completely avoidable. It certainly was not the outcome we wanted, but it was the path he chose for himself. To that end, we wish him the best in his future endeavors.
I hope this clarifies the issue.
Regards,
OSK
I think DS did take the matter a little over the top, and I do feel sorry for him. OSK is right in the fact that Devilstar could have expressed his anger / disappointment in a more suitable way, and it's too bad that it ended this way.
Thanks for clearing up the whole issue OSK.
-Naas
Oh I do understand, that he was not banned for voicing his disapproval, but more certain ways he chose to say things.
The point I did wish to address, was how much were the MOW accusations looked into. I'm sure that all the mods discussed on how to punish Devil, but did anyone follow up on any of the concerns brought up about MOW's product?
I know admins don't wish to spend their whole time policing the cargo hold, but if there is shoddy product being pushed on TDH, then you would be a little concerned right?
MOW's product always seemed tip-top and I haven't ever owned one of his pieces, but I just think its a little odd that Devil got the banned stamp, and the whole topic of the argument was kinda pushed aside. Just doesn't seem case closed to me
What is Butters' status? Is he still an active member here?
still a registered member here.
OK. Now I understand where you are coming from Brian. Thanks for taking the time to explain that!
All,
I got this news from Shawn today!
Paypal was able to recover $543 out of $560. Due back on my credit in 5 days. I guess there is SOME justice in this world.
even though he was a bit harsh on here, it's still good to know that he got all but 17 bucks back. good for him. I never would want someone to get scammed like that.
This was so unfortunate. That thread was going downhill quickly and suddenly jumped to light speed. I am glad he got most of his money back. I wonder what will happen with Butters?
good to hear he got his funds back
That is a tough break for Devilstar, he had been a member here for a while too. Now He got some money and I am sure he has had time to reflect, is there no way he would be allowed to come back? I understand the scammer was not the reason for his ban but it is clear it played a big part in it.
Glad to here he got most of the money back, a lesson learned for all of us.
Best wishes Devilstar, hope to see you around some time bro.
I'm glad to see he got his money back
Well, it's good he got some back. He seemed like a pretty cool guy all the times I've seen him or dealt with him in other threads.
so...what's gonna happen to butters?
I doubt "Butters" will post again any way.
I agree. I'd love to have devil back 8)
Curious about this myself.
Probably nothing....
For all we know, Butters did nothing wrong. Perhaps Butters was having some sort of problem that can not be explained at the immediate time; not trying to spark up any debate, but just pointing it out. Also the $17 that Devilstar2k2 did not receive seems to be the PayPal fees from the money he sent if my calculations are correct.
If Butters intended to steal Shawn's money, why would it still be in his PayPal account 2-4 weeks later?
Intersting point. If I was the type to rip somebody off like that, I sure wouldn'y leave the money in the account.
I'm not trying to take Butters off of the hook here, he was acting extremely shady with his dealings with Shawn, also not to mention his complete ignorance of PMs here on TDH and on the RPF.
So the next time Butter' offers something up for sale, are you sending him any money??
Definitely not. I don't trust him.So the next time Butter' offers something up for sale, are you sending him any money??
For all we know his mother could have died. I certainly would have stopped answering things if that happened. and I would have left the money sitting there too so paypal could get it back.
but he was banned on a nonperm. status for a while, he ended up with a total ban because of things said via PM to command staff, it says so in the reason that was posted, so it doesnt look like he'll be allowed to come back.
would I buy from Butters if he came back? only if he sent me the stuff first , lol.
should he be banned too? maybe he should be banned from selling like cookie was, but he didnt curse and be disrespectful to members and admin.
I agree with WOlfie.
HE was being pretty "tooly" about his situation.
Its bad to air so much dirty laundry in public.
In the end he got his money back good for him!
Butter's didn't have time to answer PM's but he had time to surf TDH??
Oh please...
I sit aimlessly on the computer when depressed.
*shrug*
I ignore emails and PMs then also. and depending on what the PMs said (IE if they were jumping down my throat) I wouldnt answer them for sure. Butters should have shipped the stuff. Or admitted he sold it for higher or on ebay instead if he did something like that... Butters was wrong too... but we dont know everything is all.
we do know how DS decided to deal with things though.
Good point..
I'll remember to be "respectful" if I ever decide to scam people here...
Ripcode has great stuff when its up in the cargo bay. Scam Away my friend Scam Away!
Good point..
I'll remember to be "respectful" if I ever decide to scam people here...
sounds good to me :P
i've had to take two weeks to ship things before due to personal things happening. and if someone had jumped on me like that I would have let them get their money back. granted i would have sent it back instead of letting paypal take it... but as cheap as he was selling it, he was A: scamming or B: had a personal thing for why he had to sell quickly.
I just dont like things getting ugly with out both sides of things. I'd feel kinda bad if I found out later that I had called someone names for not being quick about stuff , that something tragic had happened.
but more than likely , nothing happened it it was a lame transaction. even lamer since he didnt even scam properly and left the money in paypal lol.
but like I said earlier, i'm glad he got his money back.
Wow,
seems like i've missed a lot over the past few days
I need to stop skimming and start reading.
That's too bad it had to end in a ban like that.
When I buy, I send it _right_ then. When I sell, I ship it right then.
But everyone is NOT me. And $20 to me means a totally different thing to my son, and to my father.
For my son, its a months worth, and losing it would make him flip out, do wierd things, and act wierd. My dad, would hope that someone that needed it found it. if he noticed.
My point: You can not argue with the way someone feels or things, because its subjective. While I cant condone some of these actions, I am not judgemental either. I try to look at it like this.
If he was in a serious car crash, or lost a loved one, how would I feel?
Therefor I always reserve judgement.
So for butters, you never know what happened. For devilstar, I do not know if hes more like my son, or my dad. I can not begin to tell you how he felt, how long he saved, or how many people egged him on with 'you got scammed'.
You push someone far enough they act wierd. But since I do not know both stories I assume the truth is somewhere in the middle.
But then again I think mike tyson was innocent (some of the time) too.
as a side note, its VERY hard to put 'inflection' into someones 'typing'.
Some people are very poor at expressing themselves in text. Some people always read things as pesamistic or condescending. Some people couldnt catch a hint in text, if someone hit them with the book it was written in.
So in short. I have no opinion, but really wanted to see if anyone would read this far
Ciao,
SR
Oh, I read that far ... and the first thing that hits me about you is this ...
You are a seriously observant, wise man. Maybe even a student of human nature. Props to you buddy - that is some seriously good "voice of reason" you've got going there, and people should read it, and get something from it.
FP
agreed!!Oh, I read that far ... and the first thing that hits me about you is this ...
You are a seriously observant, wise man. Maybe even a student of human nature. Props to you buddy - that is some seriously good "voice of reason" you've got going there, and people should read it, and get something from it.
FP
unfortunately rules of the forum say no flipping out on people and cursing at them so it ended in a ban. this is a pretty strict forum about things.
I totally agree with Stormrider. I did however feel slightly disrespected by DS. We were all offering help and suggestions. Heck, even Taco offered to help him with the cost of postage to get his stuff fixed. Wickedbeard offered to step up and help too. I was impressed with the love shown by members who had no financial interest in helping, but offered anyway. Thank you guys/gals for being the class acts that you are!Jason
Cjake, would you be interested in charity in that frame of mind? I would not, no matter how good the intentions.
As for butters, maybe the scam was always intended to be whoever the paypal account belonged to. I am sure I read it was his room mates, if that is true, and something here must be, that guy is down around $500. This may explain why the money was still there.
There are a million what if's here, but the bottom line is, a liked member has been pushed to his breaking point and this has resulted in the loss of his access to spend time here, talking with other like minded people, some of which he probably feels let down by.
I am not saying he should be excused for his behaviour and disrespect, just a shame it came to this. I hope some day to see him back if the situation allows.
The user "Butters" has been banned due to entering into allegedly fraudulent transactions in the Cargo Hold.
Butters has been given 48 hours to explain the transaction and provide a good faith basis for his failure to ship merchandise.
If Butters does not produce said good faith basis, he will be permanently banned.
OSK
Excellent!! Well put Stormrider!
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