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  1. Jun 5, 2011, 2:26 PM - Re: Superjedi's GMH--Pre-Pro 2 #26

    I think the White is the gel coat showing through. The detail of damage seen in the pictures above can only be achieved by scratching/sanding through to the helmet surface below the paint layers...
  2. KaanE is offline KaanE
    Jun 5, 2011, 3:04 PM - Re: Superjedi's GMH--Pre-Pro 2 #27

    Red is White Gelcoat/Primer (I think they used white primer), green is silver paint. The keyholes are was weathered the same the ears were, silver, then weathering using diferent colours but specially grey, and then hand sanded. Anyway, the white damage was added post DP mould, almost 100% sure.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Last edited by KaanE; Jun 5, 2011 at 3:27 PM.
  3. Dahone's Avatar
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    Jun 5, 2011, 3:22 PM - Re: Superjedi's GMH--Pre-Pro 2 #28

    I think that it is the helmet surface. However I subscribe to the idea that this was damage sustained to the helmet after it's original heyday. It all is up to the individual to what your preference is.
  4. Community Founder Art Andrews's Avatar
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    Jun 5, 2011, 3:46 PM - Re: Superjedi's GMH--Pre-Pro 2 #29

    Tough call but I think it is white.
  5. High Speed Low Drag Fett 4 Real's Avatar
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    Jun 5, 2011, 4:42 PM - Re: Superjedi's GMH--Pre-Pro 2 #30

    IMHO its the gelcoat white...but was it like that when it was first painted I dont think so...ur looking at pics of a damaged helmet after it was MOLESTED
  6. superjedi's Avatar
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    Jun 5, 2011, 5:53 PM - Re: Superjedi's GMH--Pre-Pro 2 #31

    Thanks for the insight and photo manips. I'm still leaning toward exposed white gelcoat.
    Obviously there was a great deal of damage to this poor helmet after it had long been painted. The horrible demolding scar being the most visible.
    My observations earlier fell pretty much along the lines of the pic that KaanE posted, showing what is "probably" white versus silver. I still have time to decide though.

    JUNE 5, 2011

    OK! No more glistening white GMH. Primer is on.
    I chose to use Duplicolor gray primer this time around. I've used their products before and the primer is nice and tough once it's dry. Should give some really good tooth to the base coats to come. It appears to have just the slightest lean toward the blue side of the gray spectrum, and the photos exaggerate this a bit. It's really a nice smooth neutral gray.
    Before I primed, I taped off the entire inside of the helmet. I just don't like a bunch of overspray on the interiors of my buckets. Personal preference. The tape will stay on pretty much throughout the entire paint job just to keep things neat.





    So that does it for prep! Here's where the fun begins.
  7. High Speed Low Drag Fett 4 Real's Avatar
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    Jun 5, 2011, 6:36 PM - Re: Superjedi's GMH--Pre-Pro 2 #32

    May consider getting ur visor installed and taping the visor up that way u get no overspray into the helmet in the first place and dont have to worry about installing srews and screwing up the paint in the process
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    Jun 5, 2011, 6:52 PM - Re: Superjedi's GMH--Pre-Pro 2 #33

    If you compare the damage on the backside of the ROTJ helmet, there is also a fair amount of white showing through there in the same areas. As both helmets were done by the same person, it is unlikely all of that is post filming damage but was probably mostly original to the weathering and does indeed get down into the material of the helmet in scattered areas, mixed in with the silver.
  9. BGHunter is offline BGHunter
    Jun 5, 2011, 7:12 PM - Re: Superjedi's GMH--Pre-Pro 2 #34

    Most of the helmets were painted white , and the gel coat is also white , Im certin its the white paint/ Gel coat
  10. High Speed Low Drag Fett 4 Real's Avatar
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    Jun 5, 2011, 7:43 PM - Re: Superjedi's GMH--Pre-Pro 2 #35

    But what Im getting at is when it was painted it wasnt left white. When it got abused while being molded it got beat up alot....your not going to take a dremel to it and have the gouges in it also are you? I would leave those areas silver that look like they were silver, and green that should be green....you have to use some sort of logic when doing this its not paint by #s
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    Jun 5, 2011, 7:49 PM - Re: Superjedi's GMH--Pre-Pro 2 #36

    Quote Fett 4 Real said: View Post
    But what Im getting at is when it was painted it wasnt left white.
    yes, but it was weathered down into the helmet in places, >after paint< bearing out some of the white. Again, IMHO, this was not all post film damage. I could easily be wrong, but there is not much *clear* pre-filming photographic evidence to make a strong case the other way either. Not that I have seen at any rate.
  12. Spideyfett is offline Spideyfett
    Jun 5, 2011, 7:59 PM - Re: Superjedi's GMH--Pre-Pro 2 #37

    Quote superjedi said: View Post
    Hi, Alex. This will be some new territory for me, combining the layering with some topical damage. *Gulp!* Should be fun though.
    I would say definately chipped down to the helmet White.
  13. High Speed Low Drag Fett 4 Real's Avatar
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    Jun 5, 2011, 8:06 PM - Re: Superjedi's GMH--Pre-Pro 2 #38

    Its for sure white in the pics but, logically it wouldnt have been white, as a artist it doesnt make sense. If Im painting something thats supposed to be metal Im not going to "damage" the helmet and make the damage white....its just not logical. It would be silver damage...just like the dent is silver any other damage would be silver NOT white.
  14. Dahone's Avatar
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    Jun 5, 2011, 8:10 PM - Re: Superjedi's GMH--Pre-Pro 2 #39

    Way to go, superjedi. I think I may go the Duplicolor route as well. I've been using Rusto's filler primer for the armor since I've been bondoing old dents and adding new ones. But I dare not use a filler primer on the "beauty marks" of a GMH!
  15. CSK225's Avatar
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    Jun 6, 2011, 2:29 AM - Re: Superjedi's GMH--Pre-Pro 2 #40

    You're absolutely correct, F4R. I thought at first it was silver heavily affect by flash up close, but upon studying old images I've come to the conclusion that it IS white but only as a result of damages. It looks as if it's been rolling around on it's back for a while. And, no, it doesn't make sense that it would have been white originally. I have to agree.
  16. BGHunter is offline BGHunter
    Jun 6, 2011, 3:05 AM - Re: Superjedi's GMH--Pre-Pro 2 #41

    Quote Fett 4 Real said: View Post
    Its for sure white in the pics but, logically it wouldnt have been white, as a artist it doesnt make sense. If Im painting something thats supposed to be metal Im not going to "damage" the helmet and make the damage white....its just not logical. It would be silver damage...just like the dent is silver any other damage would be silver NOT white.
    I dont agree with this statment at all,, and Sandy didnt paint the whole thing gray then silver then gray then coloursshe painted bits silver bits gray in the imafes of the helmets on the tables the domes are silver and grey , whats to say she didnt add some friscuit be for these colors,
    As an artist I personally think it makes total sense , thats the way I did myine that Ive been painting any way
    also I dont really think there is any topical damage on the PP2 unlike the ROTJ at all its all layers , then mists over them

    You also need to consider Sandy wasnt painting these to match any thing the way she worked on them were as much an experiment for her as they were a paint job she was making it up as she went along
    Last edited by BGHunter; Jun 6, 2011 at 3:13 AM.
  17. RafalFett's Avatar
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    Jun 6, 2011, 3:45 AM - Re: Superjedi's GMH--Pre-Pro 2 #42

    My logic says the followings: looking at the PP2 images all the physicaly damaged areas are silver and there's no white, so I don't think that the original helmet was scraped down to the white gelcoat in the keyhole area (on the PP2 stencils I did white scratches at the physical damage just to highlight the damage). As if a painter who do a painting would intentionally leave unpainted areas to see the canvas...
  18. High Speed Low Drag Fett 4 Real's Avatar
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    Jun 6, 2011, 7:57 AM - Re: Superjedi's GMH--Pre-Pro 2 #43

    Do what you think is right, theres no real way to figure it out besides your best guess. I'll do what makes sense to me and you can do the same, neither will be wrong...but realistically if your trying to portray a real metal helmet chips will not be white.
  19. SegwayOfOhio's Avatar
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    Jun 6, 2011, 8:59 AM - Re: Superjedi's GMH--Pre-Pro 2 #44

    Super,

    While I agree with most of what has been said here concerning the 'white-weathering' coming after the fact... What continues to bug me is that it can be seen in the lower key-slots as well as the key slot box edges. I can imagine the box damage coming from storage... But the keys slots themselves?? That seems like a difficult spot to get accidentally scraped... Doesn't it?

    Perhaps someone with a little more knowledge of the casting that was done on this helmet could chime in and tell us if the casting process used back then would be consistent with the damage inside the slots?
  20. KaanE is offline KaanE
    Jun 6, 2011, 9:20 AM - Re: Superjedi's GMH--Pre-Pro 2 #45

    Quote SegwayOfOhio said: View Post
    Super,

    While I agree with most of what has been said here concerning the 'white-weathering' coming after the fact... What continues to bug me is that it can be seen in the lower key-slots as well as the key slot box edges. I can imagine the box damage coming from storage... But the keys slots themselves?? That seems like a difficult spot to get accidentally scraped... Doesn't it?

    Perhaps someone with a little more knowledge of the casting that was done on this helmet could chime in and tell us if the casting process used back then would be consistent with the damage inside the slots?
    They removed the MQ-1 board, so they touched the keyslots.
  21. SegwayOfOhio's Avatar
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    Jun 6, 2011, 10:41 AM - Re: Superjedi's GMH--Pre-Pro 2 #46

    KaanE,

    Do think that's what it is? It's from pushing the board out from the outside? Seems reasonable, if not a little excessive.

    Quote KaanE said: View Post
    They removed the MQ-1 board, so they touched the keyslots.
  22. KaanE is offline KaanE
    Jun 6, 2011, 11:04 AM - Re: Superjedi's GMH--Pre-Pro 2 #47

    I don't mean that, my point is that the keyholes have been touched FOR SURE more than once.
  23. SegwayOfOhio's Avatar
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    Jun 6, 2011, 11:28 AM - Re: Superjedi's GMH--Pre-Pro 2 #48

    KaanE,

    No doubt. That bucket as seen a few hands on it. but it's going to take more than that to strip the layers off.

    I'm not being argumentative here... just playing devils advocate. I'm guessing all the white spots were 'after the fact' damage... just trying to present other possibilities for discussion.
  24. superjedi's Avatar
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    Jun 6, 2011, 11:29 AM - Re: Superjedi's GMH--Pre-Pro 2 #49

    I agree that it doesn't seem logical that you would get that kind of topical damage in a concave area like the key slots. But the pictures do seem to show those scratches as white. Logical or not, my goal is to recreate the paint work as closely as possible.
    Great discussion!
  25. SegwayOfOhio's Avatar
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    Jun 6, 2011, 11:35 AM - Re: Superjedi's GMH--Pre-Pro 2 #50

    super,

    no doubt... and I'm guessing your recreation will be second-to-none...

    But, this discussion does raise the question... are you trying to recreate the paint work as it is? or as it was?

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