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  1. Community Founder Art Andrews's Avatar
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    Dec 30, 2006, 9:31 AM - The REAL PrePro 2 Helmet!!! #1

    Hi guys,

    I am really thrilled to be able to share this info with you although the circumstances that brought the ability for me to share this is less than ideal.

    As some of you may know, there is strong evidence that the PrePro2 costume was supposed to be THE esb hero suit. It is the suit that was most photographed for publicity. It was the suit that Kenner used for their photoshoot for the toy. It was also the Prepro2 helmet that was sent to Don Post to be cast for their helmet line.

    As long as I have been in this hobby there has been a rumor that the ESB suit was stolen. There was never really any proof, just a rumor. Well, in a way, the ESB suit, or at least the INTENDED ESB helmet was stolen as well as the jet pack. I do not know if the rest of the suit was stolen or not, but at least the helmet and the jet pack have resurfaced.

    The story about how the helmet resurfaced is an interesting one. The helmet was brought to a popular auction house with hopes of being sold for approx $80k. However, the auction house looked into the background of this particular piece and was told by Gary Kurtz (I think it was Kurtz, but it might have been Johnston... it has been a while) that it was indeed a helmet that had been stolen. I find it a bit difficult to believe that Kurtz would remember THAT helmet in particular, but regardless, however it got there, it was in private hands. Fortunately for us, a close friend was able to take a number of photos of the helmet which sadly was in VERY bad shape. This friend is NOT a member of this board and it makes me very sad to hear that someone here on this board is claiming to have taken these pics themselves. Why people can't simply stand on their own merits, talent and skill instead of lying and sucking off the effort of others like vultures, is beyond me. Anyway, while this friend had initially asked that these images not be shared, due to the dishonesty of others, he has now said that I can share these with everyone! So, I guess something good has come from this bad situation.

    This helmet was bought directly by a high end collector in CA who also has the jet pack. This is the only hero helmet and hero jet pack that we know to be in private hands.

    On a final note, I want to remind everyone that Rogue Studios' plug is a first generation casting of this helmet. Sadly you can see where the helmet was cut from the mold by careless people at Don Post... the two long scratches on the dome.

    Enjoy and share as you would like... just don't take credit for them! BTW, I think there is a LOT to be learned from these pics in regard to helmet build and assembly, so go for it!

    PS. I will not comment further on the situation that made this come about. I have said my piece and that is all I will say about it.

























  2. Rogue Studios is offline Rogue Studios
    Dec 30, 2006, 9:50 AM - Re: The REAL PrePro 2 Helmet!!! #2

    Glad you could finally post these Art. These actually helped us with indentifying the origins of the helmet buck too. Good job and by the way for some reason not having 80K at the time didn't bother me too much.

    Lee
    Last edited by Rogue Studios; Dec 30, 2006 at 10:31 AM.
  3. hansoloway's Avatar
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    Dec 30, 2006, 9:56 AM - Re: The REAL PrePro 2 Helmet!!! #3

    Wow! These are some excellent photos! A great way to start my Saturday morning! :thumbup

    So, I'm a bit confused...the person who brought it to the auction house was still able to sell it although a Lucas representative said it had been stolen?
  4. Community Founder Art Andrews's Avatar
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    Dec 30, 2006, 10:00 AM - Re: The REAL PrePro 2 Helmet!!! #4

    My understanding is that the auction house refused to sell it due to it being stolen. However, they didn't take any action against the owner. The owner ended up selling it privately.
  5. superjedi's Avatar
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    Dec 30, 2006, 10:22 AM - Re: The REAL PrePro 2 Helmet!!! #5

    Whoa! Awesome pictures. . . glad they could finally be shared!
  6. Rogue Studios is offline Rogue Studios
    Dec 30, 2006, 10:33 AM - Re: The REAL PrePro 2 Helmet!!! #6

    Yeah Art had to track the fella down to get permission and unfortunately he's not a TDH member.
  7. hansoloway's Avatar
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    Dec 30, 2006, 10:38 AM - Re: The REAL PrePro 2 Helmet!!! #7

    Another thought...I don't know if you know the actual new owner but, if it were me, (let me close my eyes and pretend for a while... ) I'd look to getting that thing restored. There are people on this very board who I'm sure would be able to repair that Don Post damage perfectly.
  8. Community Founder Art Andrews's Avatar
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    Dec 30, 2006, 10:49 AM - Re: The REAL PrePro 2 Helmet!!! #8

    I do know who the new owner is. He is pretty reclusive but a few friends, unfortunately not TDH members, have seen it. The new owner did have the broken stalk repaired but as with most of screen used collectors, he has left the rest alone as making any other changes would be considered diminishing the value and authenticity. The scratches are now part of this helmets history.
  9. propsculptor's Avatar
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    Dec 30, 2006, 10:54 AM - Re: The REAL PrePro 2 Helmet!!! #9

    Thanks Brak's Buddy!!

    Your sharing with us is very appreciated!!
  10. Community Founder Art Andrews's Avatar
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    Dec 30, 2006, 10:59 AM - Re: The REAL PrePro 2 Helmet!!! #10

    You are very welcome but the credit goes to the photographer who was generous enough to allow me to post them.
  11. Spideyfett is offline Spideyfett
    Dec 30, 2006, 11:24 AM - Re: The REAL PrePro 2 Helmet!!! #11

    All I have to say is........It's about time these got posted!!!

    Thanks Brak's ..and "whoever" else played a part in sharing these....
  12. hellopike's Avatar
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    Dec 30, 2006, 11:33 AM - Re: The REAL PrePro 2 Helmet!!! #12

    Wow. this really comes at a good time for me, as I'm getting ready to paint a PrePro2 helmet this week. Awesome BB-Now, here's something I wonder and you don't have to comment, but the only reason you were given permission to post these images was because of someone being a bit of a liar or whatever, correct? The photographer didn't want these shared publicly....

    Why the heck not? What does someone have to gain from keeping information like this a secret? That sort of behavior always confuses and upsets me. I can understand thing's like rouge studios work with the ESB helmet and a non-disclosure with Mast Replicas or whatever, but if someone had information and didn't have a contractual obligation not to share the info, why keep it to yourself when it could benfit so many others?

    But either way, its cool. I'm glad to see this photos, it's going to help a lot.

    Phil
  13. Tyler Durden's Avatar
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    Dec 30, 2006, 11:38 AM - Re: The REAL PrePro 2 Helmet!!! #13

    Art,

    If I remember correctly, it was Gary Kurtz who identified the helmet; he seemed to recall the thin 'glassing around the dent.
  14. goldenrod's Avatar
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    Dec 30, 2006, 11:41 AM - Re: The REAL PrePro 2 Helmet!!! #14

    Wow! Thanks soooooo much for sharing these photos!!!!!!!
  15. Community Founder Art Andrews's Avatar
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    Dec 30, 2006, 11:54 AM - Re: The REAL PrePro 2 Helmet!!! #15

    Quote hellopike said: View Post
    Awesome BB-Now, here's something I wonder and you don't have to comment, but the only reason you were given permission to post these images was because of someone being a bit of a liar or whatever, correct? The photographer didn't want these shared publicly....

    Why the heck not? What does someone have to gain from keeping information like this a secret? That sort of behavior always confuses and upsets me. I can understand thing's like rouge studios work with the ESB helmet and a non-disclosure with Mast Replicas or whatever, but if someone had information and didn't have a contractual obligation not to share the info, why keep it to yourself when it could benfit so many others?
    Phil,

    These pics were taken several years ago, mid 2003 if I recall correctly, and at the time this was a very sensitive issue as it was 1) a stolen item and 2) had not been sold at that point. The person who took the pictures, John, didn't want them kept secret for selfish reasons. In fact, he allowed me to share them with a few select members with the agreement that they wouldn't share them further. He didn't want these posted publicly because of the sensitive nature of the sale. Honestly, if anyone has been at fault for these not being made available to you sooner, it is because I never went back to John after the helmet was sold to ask if I could now share them. Unfortunately it was only this recent deceitfulness that prompted me to go back and ask John if I could post them. His response? "Definitely post anything you want"

    In my initial post I said:

    Quote Brak's Buddy said: View Post
    Anyway, while this friend had initially asked that these images not be shared, due to the dishonesty of others, he has now said that I can share these with everyone!
    In retrospect, that was worded poorly. John didn't give me permission because of the dishonesty going on here. I finally contacted him again and asked if I could share them, prompted by this situation. Sorry for the confusion.

    Again, I really don't want to go into that much more, but would rather focus on the positive aspect that these photos are finally available to the masses.
    Last edited by Art Andrews; Dec 30, 2006 at 11:59 AM.
  16. Jango_Wes's Avatar
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    Dec 30, 2006, 11:59 AM - Re: The REAL PrePro 2 Helmet!!! #16

    Looking at the inside of the helmet, I can see one bolt, what appears to be, holding the RF to the helmet. Other than that, I can't tell how the ear pieces are held on. Are they molded to the helmet? I honestly can't recall the pictures of Lee's plug showing the ear pieces on.

    It's a shame the Don Post employees showed such a blatent disregard towards this helmet.

    Also, Braks, you said it was rumored the suit was stolen. Pardon my ignorance, but could the suit being stolen be a reason for the color change in the gauntlets and JP as well as the change in the shoulder emblem? I know this thread is to showcase this remarkable find, and I don't want to detract from it, but I would love to pick your brain on the subject. Please, PM me.

    I can understand how the new owner doesn't want to be identifed. Had I just spent $80K on this piece, I wouldn't want the whole world knowing where I live. However, what I can't understand is how no one took legal action against the thief. Was there a statute of limitation on theft? Maybe one of our legal experts could chime in on this.

    Again, thank you for sharing this Braks. I'm glad to see this back in trustworthy hands.

    Wes
  17. Spideyfett is offline Spideyfett
    Dec 30, 2006, 12:03 PM - Re: The REAL PrePro 2 Helmet!!! #17

    Quote Brak's Buddy said: View Post
    Again, I really don't want to go into that much more, but would rather focus on the positive aspect that these photos are finally available to the masses.
    AMEN!! :thumbup :thumbup
  18. hellopike's Avatar
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    Dec 30, 2006, 12:17 PM - Re: The REAL PrePro 2 Helmet!!! #18

    Quote Brak's Buddy said: View Post
    Phil,

    These pics were taken several years ago, mid 2003 if I recall correctly, and at the time this was a very sensitive issue as it was 1) a stolen item and 2) had not been sold at that point. The person who took the pictures, John, didn't want them kept secret for selfish reasons. In fact, he allowed me to share them with a few select members with the agreement that they wouldn't share them further. He didn't want these posted publicly because of the sensitive nature of the sale. Honestly, if anyone has been at fault for these not being made available to you sooner, it is because I never went back to John after the helmet was sold to ask if I could now share them. Unfortunately it was only this recent deceitfulness that prompted me to go back and ask John if I could post them. His response? "Definitely post anything you want"

    In my initial post I said:



    In retrospect, that was worded poorly. John didn't give me permission because of the dishonesty going on here. I finally contacted him again and asked if I could share them, prompted by this situation. Sorry for the confusion.

    Again, I really don't want to go into that much more, but would rather focus on the positive aspect that these photos are finally available to the masses.
    Oh I understand absolutely, and really the most important thing is that the images are out there in the world now. I've just run into the "I've got information but I don't want to share" scenario before and it bewilders me a bit. But this is great. I'm happy you remebered about these and thought to ask if you could post them.

    Phil
  19. Community Founder Art Andrews's Avatar
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    Dec 30, 2006, 12:18 PM - Re: The REAL PrePro 2 Helmet!!! #19

    Quote Jango_Wes said: View Post
    Looking at the inside of the helmet, I can see one bolt, what appears to be, holding the RF to the helmet. Other than that, I can't tell how the ear pieces are held on. Are they molded to the helmet? I honestly can't recall the pictures of Lee's plug showing the ear pieces on.
    The ear pieces , at least the lower sections,are actually bolted in place with small brass screws. You can't see it due to the tape on the PP2, but below is a pic of the ESB helmet where you can see one of them.

    Quote Jango_Wes said: View Post
    Also, Braks, you said it was rumored the suit was stolen. Pardon my ignorance, but could the suit being stolen be a reason for the color change in the gauntlets and JP as well as the change in the shoulder emblem? I know this thread is to showcase this remarkable find, and I don't want to detract from it, but I would love to pick your brain on the subject. Please, PM me.
    Honestly, I don't know. Anything I said in regard to that would be pure speculation. We know that the RotJ and PP2 helmet were painted at the same time by the same person. However, the PP3 and ESB hero as well as the PP3 and ESB suits are a bit odd as we don't really know when they were made.

    Quote Jango_Wes said: View Post
    I can understand how the new owner doesn't want to be identifed. Had I just spent $80K on this piece, I wouldn't want the whole world knowing where I live. However, what I can't understand is how no one took legal action against the thief. Was there a statute of limitation on theft? Maybe one of our legal experts could chime in on this.
    Again, I really don't know what the deal was there. I believe if LFL had it recorded that this helmet was stolen, they could come back at any time and repossess it. I don't know if the knew owner knows it is stolen or not. He probably doesn't want to know. In addition, I doubt he paid anywhere near $80k, that was just what the original seller was wanting to get through the Auction house.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

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    Last edited by Art Andrews; Dec 30, 2006 at 12:33 PM.
  20. Community Founder Art Andrews's Avatar
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    Dec 30, 2006, 12:20 PM - Re: The REAL PrePro 2 Helmet!!! #20

    Quote hellopike said: View Post
    I've just run into the "I've got information but I don't want to share" scenario before and it bewilders me a bit.
    Phil
    I have run into that as well and find it very unfortunate. I sometimes have to say "I have information and am not allowed to share it" but I try to never just keep something solely for the sake of keeping it from others. That is simply counterproductive to what this community is all about.
  21. Tyler Durden's Avatar
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    Dec 30, 2006, 12:31 PM - Re: The REAL PrePro 2 Helmet!!! #21

    Quote Jango_Wes said: View Post
    Looking at the inside of the helmet, I can see one bolt, what appears to be, holding the RF to the helmet. Other than that, I can't tell how the ear pieces are held on. Are they molded to the helmet? I honestly can't recall the pictures of Lee's plug showing the ear pieces on.
    Of the three helmet interiors we've seen, all have the ears screwed to the helmet. The Prepro 2 ears are more than likely held on with screws, but they are underneath the duct tape strips.

    It's a shame the Don Post employees showed such a blatent disregard towards this helmet.
    "Blatent disregard" is a bit strong. At the time, the mold makers were under the impression it was an already damaged helmet. Regardless of that fact, the only damage the mold maker remembered was the knife cuts on the back. They used non-shrinking Ultracal and the helmet was stuck inside the mold. It's unclear whether the stalk broke during project—the ear cap and stalk were removed and not molded— or if the stalk broke later on.

    Pardon my ignorance, but could the suit being stolen be a reason for the color change in the gauntlets and JP as well as the change in the shoulder emblem? I know this thread is to showcase this remarkable find, and I don't want to detract from it, but I would love to pick your brain on the subject. Please, PM me.
    When the Prepro 2 suit was completed, ILM already had at least 4 finished suits. From what we have gathered, I believe ESB suit change happened before any of the Prepro 2 parts were stolen.
  22. Spideyfett is offline Spideyfett
    Dec 30, 2006, 12:43 PM - Re: The REAL PrePro 2 Helmet!!! #22

    Great STUFF/info!!


    Not to take away from this thread but I think it's along the same lines.....you guys do have to admit, Micke did come pretty close....
    http://www.thedentedhelmet.com/showthread.php?t=13552

    AMAZING!!
  23. Jango_Wes's Avatar
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    Dec 30, 2006, 12:52 PM - Re: The REAL PrePro 2 Helmet!!! #23

    Thanks for clearing up my questions. I don't know nearly as much about the costume as I would like.

    TD: Maybe I'm just wired different, but when I have someone else's property, already damaged or not, I do my best to get it back to them in the same condition I recieved it. Blatent disregard may have been a bit strong, but at the least, it shows me an "oh well, it ain't mine" attitude. Not trying to start an arguement, just stating my opinion.

    Wes
  24. Community Founder Art Andrews's Avatar
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    Dec 30, 2006, 12:53 PM - Re: The REAL PrePro 2 Helmet!!! #24

    Micke's job is nothing short of breathtaking. I absolutely LOVE that helmet!!!
  25. Community Founder Art Andrews's Avatar
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    Dec 30, 2006, 1:17 PM - Re: The REAL PrePro 2 Helmet!!! #25

    Not sure if this pic has been shared on here before or not, but here is the jet pack, also owned by the same collector, and believed to be the PP2 pack.



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