An ESB Helmet...in ROTJ! Another Photo Found! 02-18-03

While browsing through some Fett pics for comparative purposes, I noticed something that I had previously overlooked. Check out this still from Chronicles:



Now at first, I thought what I was seeing was simply an ROTJ stunt helmet, which is still an exciting find for me. However while comparing the weathering marks, I noticed an ESB white "decal" (decal not necessarily meaning sticker) on the left ear-piece. Also note the helmet "stripes" are yellow. And the weathering on the helmet matches an ESB helmet. Soooo there ya have it folks!



-edited to update image

Hey Tyler amazing find. Can we see the entire still to get an idea of which part of the film to look for it.

That's where Boba is jumping off the sail barge...I'm not sure you see that exact shot in the movie or not (someone has my movies at the moment ).

Well it's clear Boba wanted to die with his best looking helmet on, so he switched real quick.

OOOOOOOH! Tk-Fett and I were chatting a little on this topic. TK brought up a good point.....can Team ROTJ claim this helmet as theirs now?

That's exactly what I am going to check when I get the ROTJ dvd in. Max is right on. It's the still in Chronicles when he ready to jump off the barge. I'm curious to see if it pops up again anywhere in that scene.

MaxPlague wrote:
That's where Boba is jumping off the sail barge...I'm not sure you see that exact shot in the movie or not (someone has my movies at the moment ).

The detail isn't very visible, but this helmet might also be an ESB-styled helmet.

SWEET PICTURE!

Tyler, fantastic find! However, I wanted to point out a few things... First, that picture is not in the movie. Perhaps it was an early idea for having JB run across the deck of the Sail Barge to take off whereas in the final cut we seem him take a few steps and then the Jet Pack ignites. Second, after checking out a number of clips of that scene, I can't see the ESB helmet anywhere although at times it is too blurry to see. However, I don't think the ESB was seen in RotJ until the SE. Still a fantastic find although you have to ask yourself why such a devout ESb fan was looking at RotJ refs....

Maybe it's from a stunt-shot when he crahes into the sailbarge?

Just an idea..

-Mikael

Since I don't have a copy of the Chronicles (yet), what year was it printed (before or after the Special Editions)? If it was after, then this is my theory. As most of us know, the ESB helmet was used in the added scenes of Fett. I suspect that this was possibly a shot from a scene they were going to add to RotJ/SE, but ended up on the cutting room floor. As BB noted, there is no conclusive shots in the original RotJ of the ESB helmet.

By the way Tyler, nice find! Who wants to make a nice, hi-res, 8x10 photo paper copy of it for me?

Hey man, I'm thinking that might be a stunt suit after all. Look at the left gauntlet, looks kinda funny to me. Also, he seems to be missing the cloth belt pouch on that same side. Does anything else seem off?

.... You ROTJ party poopers!

I just got the DVD's in today, and I'll have a peek myself. Though I am not expecting to see the helmet in the film, anyway.

Funny you should mention that point about the Chronicles book, BF. I was wondering when it was published for a slightly different, though related, reason. While gathering more information about the "additional weathering" on the AOSW -believed ESB Hero- helmet, notice the page that has Fett in a close up from the Executor bridge and two shots of the helmet on a pole to the right. Well, the two helmets in those photos are the same hero helmet, except that the helmet on the pole has the added weathering to the hero. My best explanation is that the scratches were added for the SE. So would that mean the photo is from the SE, meaning that there could possibily be SE content in the Chronicles book?

About the suit, you can see the left gauntlet practically half-open. And if I am seeing the picture correctly, is there a button closure on the visible ammo pouch? Didn't the SE suit have the ammo belt with the button closures, ala ESB?
The helmet is not the SE/ESB hero, though it could very well just be a stunt ESB.

And as much as it pains me and makes my eyes bleed to see ROTJ stills, I have to remember that ESB can learn from ROTJ, and ROTJ can learn from ESB. We're all chasing the same character. I just can't help it if your suit is butt-ugly. :p

I've got Chronicles at home . . . I'll check the publish date on it when I get back if no one else chimes in before then.

It would be ABOUT the time of the SE's but . . . just going from memory, I don't RECALL there being any SE content in it, but, it has been awhile since i've looked through it.

Jer

The Japanese version of the SW Chronicals was published in 1995 and the USA version was done 3-4 years later however.
There is no SE stuff in the Chronicals book.
Both books contents are identical except that one is in Japanese and the covers are different.
The Japenese version also cost $325 where the USA version cost $150.

I have both versions, I first bought the Japanese version, then I got the USA version so I could read it. :p
Lynn

micke wrote:
Maybe it's from a stunt-shot when he crahes into the sailbarge?
Just an idea..
-Mikael

Mikael,
You are right on. When they built the barge the only finished one side. If you look at the still he is heading towards the barge not away, and is standing on a spring board. This picture is most likely the stuntman jumping into the barge.
Mike

MaxPlague wrote:
Hey man, I'm thinking that might be a stunt suit after all. Look at the left gauntlet, looks kinda funny to me. Also, he seems to be missing the cloth belt pouch on that same side. Does anything else seem off?

Yeah, the jet pack looks funny.

Either, it's rubber, and wobbling forward...or a cut + paste altogether. Too cropped and faded looking.

I think it's a stunt, also.

Are there any other Fett pics like that in yer chronicles book?

I just watched ROTJ again, and still-framed the "bounce" scene. Definitely looks like the ESB helmet, and the pack is rubber. Everything falls apart when he hits the barge. Looked like he could have been hurt by the rocket hitting him in the back of the head, too.

Rodann, I have to agree with you. After watching the "take-off" from the barge scene to the "land on the skiff" scene, before the Luke cutaway, I believe it is an ESB helmet. And you can see that same rubbery, crooked-*** tip on backback that is in the Chronicles book.

The real question here is....

if Boba's jet pack was rubber, why did it ignite??!?!

Your right! A rubber jet pack could never ignite!!!

bfett81 wrote:
The real question here is....

if Boba's jet pack was rubber, why did it ignite??!?!

It DIDN'T ignite. Watch it again, frame-by-frame. The "ignition" was animated. Poorly, I might add.

Did they have any stunt helmets for the ROTJ helmet?
I've only seen 1 stunt helmet and that's the one in the Lucasfilm archives book. Perhaps they just decided to use that one. people don't really notice it's brief appearance anyway..Except for us geeks

The Jet Pack is in Steve Sansweet's possession i believe. I recall some photos on his site and the text stated it was a stunt version..I'll check it out.
The ignition was animated on i think.

-Mikael

Here's the stunt JP:
http://www.toysrgus.com/images-props...-backpack.html

-Mikael

which ignition are you talking about being an animation? In the bucket head it shows fett attached to a cable and a small explosion takes place and they lift him via cable. Also, notice his right gaunt his just tape up with electrical tape. Either this was right before a unused stunt, or it's just a last minute publicity shot before they took off the gear.

Check out the pic of him hitting the skiff. His rocket is bent beside his helmet.

I love that pic too. I was thinking, we weather our gloves by leaving them in the sun. You guys think the ESB gloves weren't stolen with the suit and they just faded in Yuma? Random thought..

Blastech: The ignition when he takes off from the sailbarge.
The scene with the explosion..maybe you refer to the scene were he lands on the skiff?


BTW, the ESB stunt seems to have a pretty big crack on the right side in the lucasfilm archives book..If you look carefully it looks like it's a crack in the same spot:

I would believe they used the ESB stunt helmet in ROTJ.
Any opinions?

-Mikael

The paint/weathering on the ESB stunt is different than the ESB helmet in the ROTJ still. However, you noticed a good point about the ESB helmets. The AOSW ESB hero helmet also has a crack in the same spot. That particular area on the helmet seems to be a high stress point, since we have seen pics of two helmets with the crack in roughly the same area- and possibly a third.

Don't all ROTJ helmets look like stunt helmets?...I couldn't resist. LOL.

C17LM wrote:
Don't all ROTJ helmets look like stunt helmets?...I couldn't resist. LOL.

I always thought they looked a bit more Don Post-ish!

::This is Blastech::

I mean when Han hits the pack. I dunno about the others.

The gauntlet may look funny because the pic was taken without a flash, with motion. That will create a blur. Also, the Chronicles was definitely published before the SE, though there is *one* reference to the pending SE somewhere.

Just found it. In the part just before the Holiday Special, they tell about deleted scenes from ANH, and mention the Jabba scene. "A new version will appear in the Star WarsL Special Edition." This may have been before they even decided to do SE of all three for all we know. Definitely no other reference to SE though.

***Please excuse brief, off topic hijack***

what the hell is going on with the "Extra antenna" near the rangefinder in the right hand picture posted by Micke just above a bit?

Here's the link in case it's too much effort to scroll up.

http://www.katode.org/noguchi/web/boba/stunt.jpg

Can I put one on my ROTJ bucket, (I'm a sucker for extra gadgets and gizmo's) or is it just broken. Looks like the extra bit is the usual RF angle and the actual RF is bent away from the dome a bit.

Any thoughts?

*** here endeth the hijack, Sorry***

It's not an extra antenna, it's a crack in the helmet.

Other side of the helmet near the RF, BF. I was wondering this too.

It's part of the stalk that has broken out. It could indicate a cut-away section of the hollow stalk to allow for electronics.

Interesting... I see what you mean.

Looks like an other appearance of the infamous ESB in ROTJ. And this helmet DOES appear to be in ROTJ.



It's a little tough to see, but you can see it in the scene after Luke swats Fett in the Jet Pack with the saber. This helmet has the right side damage and "cats claw" damage to the upper right part of the dome that is seen on the ESB helmet. More weirdness....

What's goin' on with the gaunt hoses in that pic? They look out of control!

Nice spot, Ego! But what I think you are seeing is a shoulder braid that has fallen off his shoulder. It's still a unique occurance to be sure!

Man you guys have sharp eyes. I have seen that scene a hundred times and never noticed the "cats claw" damage.

I'm going to have to watch the whole Jabba's Palace and Sail barge scenes in slow-mo. I have no doubt there have to be a couple spots w/ the ROTJ suit but an ESB helmet (my favorite combination), but I want to see an actual screen shot. The above is not an actual screen grab since Luke's saber blade is black, but was still likely from the very same raw footage.

Hey Slave 1,

It's a tough spot in the scene due to the "flash" from Luke's saber hitting Fett's backpack, but I do have a couple of caps from the scene. I'll have to post it tonight.

I just watched the skiff scene. The only thing I can find that remotely resembles Luke's lightsaber hitting Fett's pack is when Luke deflects a shot from the barge and it hits behind Fett. Luke's blade doesn't actually get close to Fett at all. Another funny thing about the whole skiff scene is that if you watch in slow motion, right as Han is swinging at the jet pack, there's a huge chunk of the jet pack missing where Han is going to hit it! Possibly a result of trying to shape the explosion that came out of the pack. Something else slightly off topic that cracks me up about that scene--keep following it in slow motion after Boba gets hit and watch the kick that Luke puts on the bad guy in front of him--he misses by a lot!

Ah jeez yeah, I noticed that kick without even going in slow motion. It took me about 17 years, but I finally did notice it. All that time I just couldn't take my eyes off Fett. But then I got curious to see which aliens were on the other skiff, and watched that and just couldn't believe it. Marquand should have known better.

They must have known that it would take two decades for people to take their eyes off Fett so they didn't care about the kick.

How about an even closer look at this screencap


Looking at the helmet this close, I don't see the "cat's claw" mark anymore, nor do I see any indications of the right ear decal. Look at the rangefinder; two tiers, not three. The more obvious clue is the weathering, definately the RotJ helmet in this sequence. It is very possible that the stunt double wore one of the ESB stunt helmets while Jeremy wore the RotJ helmet. They had no idea that 20 years later that we'd catch it.

Hey All,

I have some pics that a friend of mine took for me
of Boba from that scene
when they were out on location in the Ca. desert.

I can scan them but dont have a space on the net to post them here .
any one able to help me with this ?

Max

Someone mentioned the hole in Fett's jet pack in that scene. Even earlier, in the palace, as Boba's getting his mack on with the ladies, the hole is there.

Freeze frame and slow-advance through the scene as he walks away from Rystall. There you can see the hole as he passes in front of the camera.

Boba Fett 1138 wrote:
Hey All,

I have some pics that a friend of mine took for me
of Boba from that scene
when they were out on location in the Ca. desert.

I can scan them but dont have a space on the net to post them here .
any one able to help me with this ?

Max

Max,
You can send them to me at jace@dugan.ws and I'll host them for you on my server. Otherwise, I think secol_fett setup a free upload service to his server too (there's a post around here somewhere about it).

Here's the pic hosting post:

http://tdh.prop-planet.com/viewtopic...=4034&forum=19

I've noticed a couple more things on the shot of him running across the barge. His left gauntlet rocket does look off. As mentioned before, there is a bit of motion blur, but to me it still doesn't look as detailed as it should. Plus, the gauntlet rocket looks really small! The right gauntlet appears taped together. More apparent if you look at the actual pic in the Chronicles. And has it occured to anyone else to wonder where he's hiding his blaster?

Slave1 wrote:
...And has it occured to anyone else to wonder where he's hiding his blaster?

His blaster had already been chopped in half by Luke at that point and was in pieces on the floor of the skiff.

Okay, I was assuming it was supposed to be a cut section from where he exits the barge and then flies over to where Luke is.

That's what I thought when I first saw the pic too.

phantomfett wrote:
Another funny thing about the whole skiff scene is that if you watch in slow motion, right as Han is swinging at the jet pack, there's a huge chunk of the jet pack missing where Han is going to hit it!

PF, do you mean a "hole" like this?

A couple of things ....


TD - you've made me a very happy guy Now We can officially say that the ESB Helmet on an ROTJ suit is Screen Accurate !!!

Go ahead, tell me I'm wrong Albeit inly a spit second, perhaps even just a frsme or two, but it counts !!


As far as the Jet Pack thing goes ... I noticed this way back, and forgot to even mention it here.

I was just talking about this recently with a friend, and nearest we can come up with, is that they pre-chunked out of the pack (stunt pack) and put the pyrotechnics in for when they were ready to do the scene, because it would have been too dangerous for it to actually explode while on the actor/stunt double for a couple of reasons.

First off, blowing up models is far different from containing an enclosed explosion in such close qaurters without first getting into the engineering aspects of what the pack was made of, how combustable those materials were, as well as the trajectory of the explosion in relation to directing the explosion outward from the pack, instead of having the whole pack explode by accident because the jet pack would have been a closed container. So when they pre-chunked it out, they most likely put some kind of baffle in the hole so that the explosion wouldn't set the whole pack afire, and this allowed them to use directional explosives so they wouldn't have to worry about the closed container bottleneck.

Made sense to me ?

They probably never took into consideration that people 25-30 yrs later would be paying that close attention

yep, that looks like the one !

Anyone gonna take ashot at doing that for their suit ? !

It's technically "Screen Accurate"

Well, another thing, just to follow up on what FP was saying, there's cases all throughout the trilogy of battle damaged things being damaged before the battle! One of the best and easiest spots to see this is also on the sail barge battle, when Luke takes a blaster bolt to the hand. Watch the scene in slow motion . . . his hand actually has the metal damage shownig through before the shot even hits him. But because you're expecting it, and your eyes aren't looking there, you don't notice it.

Another good place to look is in the lightsaber battle in TESB between Luke and Vader. Right before Vader chops off Luke's hand, he chops through a railing . . . but, watch again, the railing is already chopped up.

Like FP said . . . . it's too dangerous to do stuff like that and . . . just from a logistics point of view . . . why bother!

Jer

P.S. All sorts of examples over at my website. The Star Wars Blooper Guide at http://www.egosystem.com/starwars

Brak's--Yes, that would be the hole I was talking about. Neat photo--where'd it come from?

Heh heh! From the Archive of course!

Wow! You took that pic in the archive?

Do you have any stories to tell?

Hey Glitch, glad to see you around again! Where ya been?

Still trying figure out how that running pic figures in to the sequence. He has no gun, as I pointed out before. But also pointed out before, it's supposed to be after Luke slices his pistola in half.

So now I have to wonder, if he is standing in the middle of the skiff, where is the railing?

Is he really possibly on the barge itself. Or . . . is what he is standing some sort of stuntman spring board prior to smacking into the side of the barge?

Slave1 wrote:
...Or . . . is what he is standing some sort of stuntman spring board prior to smacking into the side of the barge?

Ding ding ding, we have a winner!

My bad. Desloc already posted the idea as I read back through the posts.

I really need to go back and take a look at ROTJ frame by frame. It sure would be a lot easier on me if Lucas would just release the original flics on DVD.

No!!!!!! Of course I didn't! I am far too lowly a peon to get to visit the archives!

Glitch wrote:
Wow! You took that pic in the archive?
Do you have any stories to tell?

hey braks, don't tell me thats a real pic thats just a photoshopped pic right???

I'm sure there were probably multiple stunt packs, but I can say for sure that Steve's jet pack is not rubber.

ETA - I have to amend this. I'm going to hedge my bets a little. Parts of the jet pack definately appear to NOT be rubber. There is at least one part on top that would get hit first, that looks like it could possibly be a hard rubber. You can see where paint is flaking off on most of the parts of the pack, and there's only one where something black shows through. The rest of the parts where it looks like paint is scraped down all the way, the pack doesn't have any black showing through, and seems to have a whitish looking plastic at the base. However, it could be that the rubber was soooo coated with something that would harden, and that is what is showing as the base. But, if that were the case, then I think more detail would be lost.

Nope, that is a real pic. You can even see the guts dug out out of the pack several frames before Han hits the pack with the Force Pike and when Fett has his back to the camera firing a shot at Luke.

Appolo_50 wrote:
hey braks, don't tell me thats a real pic thats just a photoshopped pic right???

????saFett wrote:
I'm sure there were probably multiple stunt packs, but I can say for sure that Steve's jet pack is not rubber.

However, it could be that the rubber was soooo coated with something that would harden, and that is what is showing as the base. But, if that were the case, then I think more detail would be lost.
[/quote]

The missile wasn’t made out of rubber. Same for Jango’s Jet Pack in ATOC. In the webdoc 10 „Good to G.O“ watch the fight between Obi-Wan and Jango. The jedi flings the mandolorian over his shoulders and he falls on the back. The jet pack should unrelentingly be tattered when made out of resin. So I think; the main body was rubber.

Hey guys, long time no post!

Anyway, I'm almost positive this is not when he takes off from Jabba's barge or when he lands on the skiff but a BTS photo of the stunt man preparing to run and jump against the side of the barge. This explains why the suit is not a "hero". Look at the JP missle, it looks a little floppy also.