The ESB and AOSW helmet differences

I've always thought the ESB helmet was the one used for the AOSW display. But some doubts have risen .
When I refer to left and right, I mean if you would have the helmet on, so it would be on the right side of the helmet, not right side of the pictures,


1. the shape seems more flared on the ESB movie helmet.
2. AOSW helmet has more silver battle damage painted on the right cheek area (in the black part).
3. just above the left eye on the ESB helmet there is a small series of silver dots (damage) these are not prestent on the AOSW helmet.
4. in the maroon/red visor area from about halfway down the left side the damage appears to be different. Theres more silver on the AOSW helmet.

There some others, but take a look C 4 u self.




I'm not saying it not the same helmet, but that there are diferences.

Here's a link to one of the ESB helmet pics.

http://www.essat.cl/cdref/0001_0100/Boba_Fett_012.jpg


The other pic I compred it too was on the Boba fett Ref CD\Boba Fett\Exhibits\DCB - AoSW, UK (helmet02.jpeg)

The range finder at the AOSW has more sivler damage on it.

I believe the AOSW helmet IS the ESB Hero helmet. Granted your points are valid. However, I believe these differences still allow the AOSW to be the ESB hero.

The flare is a dicey area. I'm sure anyone who is very familiar with Fett's helmet can tell you that depending on the angle of the helmet it's shape and profile can change dramatically. In the photo you posted, the flare is very prominent. In the exhibit photos, as with movie photos, the flare varies depending on the angle. Also, keep in mind that the ESB helmet at AOSW is placed flat and very close to the collar plate. Most of the ESB shots have the helmet sitting quite high on the neck further enhancing its flare.

I too have have noticed the additional damage on the AOSW ESB Fett helmet. I believe this damage was added to the helmet for filming the additional Fett scenes in ROTJ the Special Edition. If you'll note, the additions are, for the most part, silver weathering-- very easily applied or touched up over the exisiting paint job. Also, the ESB paint job is very intricate. I could not imagine the ILM artists, as talented as they are, replicating the weathering patterns perfectly on multiple helmets given the time constraints. Check out the AOSW photos against the ESB photos, and you'll see the exsisting weathering is identical except for those additional scratches. Check out the photo below:



If look at pictures of the ROTJ SE suit (ROTJ suit/ESB helmet), the ESB helmet has the additional scratches, thus my reasoning for them being added for the SE. The AOSW helmet appears to be the ROTJ SE helmet, which appears to be the ESB hero helmet with additional scratches. I do agree those scratches are not present in ESB and should not be replicated on a true ESB helmet!

I have been wandering for awhile now what is a HERO helmet?

The "hero" helmet or prop from a film is the one that is used for all the close up shots or publicity shots. It would be the most detailed and "polished" prop of the bunch. So when someone says ESB "hero," they are referring the helmet that was seen or used in all the close up shots.

The term "hero" means any costume or prop that is used in up close and needs to be very detailed or it needs to work or preform some type of action. The term "stunt" refers to costumes or props that are used for stunts or background shots and dosn't need to be very detailed or perform.

Most hero props are very detailed and are done up nice because they will be seen on film for a bit, stunt props are just thrown together and don't looks so good.
HTH,
Lynn

Thanks guys thats kinda what I figured but I knew someone around here would know for sure.

Perhaps,just perhaps it was just another version?.?.? Consider the famous 4 ESB "unfinished helmets" pic on the FettCD.If the paintjobs were verrrry close even back then,it would be hard to tell after 22+ years of handling,and the "weathering" would change a bit due to that handling.More nicks,smudges,scratches from just genuine handling which on a battle damaged helmet would make the helmet of yesterday's pic not seem correct with todays'.

Am I making sense?

Steve

Here is the picture in question. I agree with Tyler in that the paint jobs on the Hero and AoSW helmets are too similar to be different helmets (unless they hired some of the masters here to paint it for them) In this picture, look at the right red portion of the T-visor (the left side of the picture). The weathering is distinctly different on each one. I don't think that when the took this picture twenty-five years ago that 800 Fettheads would be studying it as intensly as we are.

True,true,but they are also "unfinished" just playing devils advocate for the record I think the AOSW,and Hero are indeed the same,but then again things could change,......although I'd like to see this ONE consistency with ESB left alone so we ESB'ers have at least ONE difinitive closeup reference.

Steve

Check out the RF's in TD's pics. The thickness of the stalks are different. They look like the angles are identical, so it's not just different views


*what I wouldn't give for one of those 4 helmets in BF's pic....*

Thanks, BF. That is the photo I like to pull out in regard to other helmets possibly being painted close enough to pass for the hero. One can tell from that photo, even in a photo as poor as that one, that none of those helmets could pass for the hero helmet in ESB stills/photographs--further lending to the plausability of the AOSW helmet being the ESB hero.

I agree DL, that with Fett, things are always being discovered and what was once gospel refuted. The Fett Bible has more white-out marks than an in-class college essay. So, there may be a piece of evidence out there that proves the AOSW helmet to not be THE ESB hero...but up to now, the evidence shows otherwise...

Blastech wrote:
Check out the RF's in TD's pics. The thickness of the stalks are different. They look like the angles are identical, so it's not just different views

It's the angle. In the ESB pic, you can see the left side of the T-visor. In the AoSW pic, you can't. You can also notice the angle difference by looking at the rangefinder. I'm with you on this one TD. Unless I see something definitive, I'm content they are one and the same.

I've always heard the ESB costume was stolen. Why did they leave the helmet?

It was in a different crate, from what I heard.

Well,

We've all heard the infamous stolen ESB suit story. I'm not sure how much evidence we have to actually back up that claim. In fact, I'm not even sure how it was started. But one way or another, most people have prescribed to the fact that the ESB suit was stolen. I am also willing to go along with that claim, until something more concrete comes to light. But it would stand to reason, that it is possible the entire suit was not kept in the same crate/container. If you've seen the old pics of the LFL archives, you can see it wasn't the most organized place in the world. In most LFL shots, the helmets are on shelves, while the costumes are crated up.

Bottom line is I'm not sure we have conclusive evidence of the true fate of the ESB suit. Again, I still do believe that, for whatever reason, the ESB helmet did survive and quite possibly other parts.

The helmet at the AOSW IS the ESB hero helmet.

Silver paint can wear off very easily, as silver paint is very soft, maybe someone was cleaning the helmet or removing the marker line that runs around the helmet and cleaned off a few scratches by mistake.

Keith.

EDIT: I see what you mean now about the scratches, the AOSW helmet has scratches that it didn't have in ESB, i thought you were talking about the scratches in the center of the cheek, that are no longer there on the AOSW helmet.

Maybe they painted a few more silver scratches for the ROTJ SE? or thought about using the ESB helmet again for ROTJ, before they decided to recast it in fiberglass...who knows, but its the same helmet anyway.

DL44 Blaster wrote:
True,true,but they are also "unfinished" just playing devils advocate for the record I think the AOSW,and Hero are indeed the same,but then again things could change,......although I'd like to see this ONE consistency with ESB left alone so we ESB'ers have at least ONE difinitive closeup reference.

Steve

I don't think the helmets in that picture are "unfinished", the first two and the last one are the ESB helmets and the picture must have been taken a long time after ESB because the the other props and maybe the third helmet in the picture are from ROTJ.
I would say that they are just broken or had some parts removed for casting the ROTJ version of the helmet.

Well, the keyboard monster in the background is from ROTJ, that's for sure. Look at Those first two helmets on the shelf. Look st the right upper cheeks damage. Is one of these helmets the AOSW helmet?

Keith,

I agree. The third helmet in the bunch is a bit of an odd-ball when compared to the other three helmets, which are definitely ESB is details and painting. Although the odd-ball helmet is similar in over-all color (i.e. the green) to the other helmets.

I've actually compared those four helmets to the AOSW helmet and ESB stills/video, and they did not match up.

I'm glad you compared them to the AOSW helmet and stills from the film, as i've been meaning to do that for ages.
They must be stunt or back-up helmets then.

Keith.

Here is a comparison photo:



You'll notice that while they are similar, there are areas that are obviously different. Most noticable is the absence of anything remotely similar to the upward-pointing blast mark on the right temple of the dome above the red band.

tylerdurden wrote:
Here is a comparison photo:



You'll notice that while they are similar, there are areas that are obviously different. Most noticable is the absence of anything remotely similar to the upward-pointing blast mark on the right temple of the dome above the red band.

It looks like that blast mark is there - it's just a trick of the light.

If you look at the two left most helmets, the silver paint is just picking up a background reflection and blending in with the helmet color.

The third one is certainly different from the others though - the middle of the brow rim has a different pattern of battle damage.

Steve

Yeah, you're right, Stevie. There is some silver weathering for the blast marks there. Although, it still doesn't appear to be in the same configuration as the AOSW. But I do agree there are blast marks there!

The middle helmet looks like it's still beieng painted. The silver is in the coorect place, but still needs grey painted over it maybe?

No wonder the colors are hard to match. The upper cheeks look different on four of those helmets.

So, if one wanted to paint an accurate replica of the ESB hero helmet would they go off the AOSW helmet? or........?

Yes

Go off the AOSW helmet in conjunction with ESB film stils. There are a couple reasons for this:

1) Remember there is additional weathering on the AOSW helmet. Whether this is a result of touch-ups done after filming or due to paint chipping away while in storage, the AOSW helmet has additional marks that do not appear in ESB. The additional areas are , for the most part, quite noticeable. But you definitely wouldn't want to include these areas on an ESB helmet-- ROTJ SE helmet, yes.

2) To paraphrase a very talented painter from the board, time, dust, and LFL "archiving" can certainly take its toll on the helmet-- not to mention the helmet is 20 plus years old. So, having the stills to check against the AOSW helmets will help you determine the integrity of the colors/weathering of the AOSW/ESB helmet.