Hypothetical Cross-Forum Conduct

  1. #1

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    Hypothetical Cross-Forum Conduct

    This is all Hypothetical of course, but...
    Let's say that I am a Mod on another forum
    We'll call it "Fett Freaks"
    And let's also say that I am just a member on another forum
    We'll call it "Jango Junkies"


    Ok, now lets pretend that fellow member on the "Jango Junkies" forum says things that I don't care for on the "Jango Junkies" forum, but he is also a member on the "Fett Freaks" forum.

    Would I be justified to ban him from the "Fett Freaks" forum (because I am powerless on "Jango Junkies" )?

    Or would I just be being a ******* & abusing my position as a Mod at "Fett Freaks" by banning him there?

  2. #2

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    Re: Hypothetical Cross-Forum Conduct

    Hypothetically, of course, it would be textbook admin abuse, so I wouldn't do it. Now, if he were to say something on "Fett Freaks" that would be offensive to you, you'd be more than justified to take action.

    However, it's pretty obvious abuse of administrative privileges otherwise. The only possible way I personally can even think it might be acceptable would be if you own the "Fett Freaks" forum yourself; you're allowed to run it as you wish if you own it, and it's your decision.

    That's just my take on this hypothetical situation.

  3. #3
    charlie's Avatar
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    Re: Hypothetical Cross-Forum Conduct

    Well....difficult question. These forums....well, there is nothing that mandates who can be a member and who can't. I think a lot of discretion would have to be used. I would also say the content of the posting is a major factor. If the said member is just saying things like "I hate Boba cause he's green" or "Boba went out like a punk in ROTJ" and you disagree...well then banning him for that would not cool. But if he is making threats, racists remarks, like that. A "preemptive" ban might ok. I would also wonder if there are other mods on the "fett freaks" forums. If you're the sole mod, you can pretty much do what you want. If there are other mods, I'd get their input.

    Charlie

  4. #4

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    Re: Hypothetical Cross-Forum Conduct

    jeod66 said: View Post
    However, it's pretty obvious abuse of administrative privileges otherwise. The only possible way I personally can even think it might be acceptable would be if you own the "Fett Freaks" forum yourself; you're allowed to run it as you wish if you own it, and it's your decision.
    charlie said: View Post
    If you're the sole mod, you can pretty much do what you want.
    Ok, let's go with that.
    I'm the Owner of "Fett Freaks"
    Since it is my own forum, I can do as I please.
    However, I am wanting to know if i'm justified.
    No Racism, no recasting, no threats involved.

  5. #5

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    Re: Hypothetical Cross-Forum Conduct

    The sketchy word is "justified." If you don't want that particular person around with nothing useful to contribute, you had might as well get rid of them. You don't want to ward off potential visitors by appearing to permit nonsense from trolls.

    I'd personally go with charlie's preemptive ban idea, along with a warning of some sort about forum conduct; in my experience, it will either cause him to shape up on your forum or act out more, which will thus almost certainly give you a legitimate reason to get rid of them.

    If he flips out on "Jango Junkies" about it to everyone else, I'm sure others will agree with you, on account of his obviously poor conduct there. Trolling doesn't work, and always puts mods in a tough situation. Regardless, it's your forum to run as you please.

  6. #6

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    Re: Hypothetical Cross-Forum Conduct

    Staying Hypothetical

    I suppose that i am just wondering if people's actions on any one forum should affect their membership on another forum.
    (Recasting , ripping people off, racism, and pedophilia aside of course)

  7. #7
    Community Founder Art Andrews's Avatar
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    Re: Hypothetical Cross-Forum Conduct

    I would say it totally depends on the situation. I have always felt a good admin has to work hard not to let their personal feelings weigh into their decisions, which is a very very hard thing to do. I guess you would have to ask yourself what is your purpose as an admin. My answer is that as an admin you are somewhat of a shepherd of the "flock" and it is your job, to some degree to protect them. I would think there would be a great number of things a member might do external to a board that could get them banned. However, I would think, just generally being a jerk isn't one of those things. If a person is a jerk on board A but plays nice on board B, should they be bannned preemptively? I would think not. However, if the person has shown a consistant pattern of abuse on other boards, that might be a bit different. In many of the cases you stated above (such as known recasters, pedophiles, etc) I think preemptive bannings would be justifiable. However, if it just comes down to you not liking the guy or the guy not liking you, I am not sure that is enough to stand on. However, I have always been of the belief that if you give a bad apple enough rope, they will eventually hang themselves, so in your "hypothetical" situation, just give the person time and they will give you cause to get rid of them... or who knows... it is rare but possible they will turn over a new leaf!

  8. #8

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    Re: Hypothetical Cross-Forum Conduct

    Officially, no, they shouldn't. Rethinking this, I'd honestly consider sending the guy a PM on one of the forums nicely asking him to stop acting like a jerk.

    Just something simple; you wouldn't even have to mention your own forum. If he would keep acting up, then I'd drop him-he can't complain that he didn't have ample warning of his actions, and there's been time for him to see the error of his ways.

    While I'd be upset if it happened to me, there would have been more than enough warning, and (as a forum owner) I'd want to keep out bad influences that might give me a bad reputation. People realize trolls' nonsense, and have greater respect for those that take care of them-first a warning, maybe a suspension even, then swing the banhammer. That's what I would do if it would happen to me.

  9. #9
    DutchFett's Avatar
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    Re: Hypothetical Cross-Forum Conduct

    slave1pilot said: View Post
    Ok, let's go with that.
    I'm the Owner of "Fett Freaks"
    Since it is my own forum, I can do as I please. However, I am wanting to know if i'm justified.
    No Racism, no recasting, no threats involved.
    I'd say no then, a forum is a place for everybody.
    In my opinion you may only ban someone for racism, recasting and such.

  10. #10
    Community Founder Art Andrews's Avatar
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    Re: Hypothetical Cross-Forum Conduct

    DutchFett said: View Post
    I'd say no then, a forum is a place for everybody.
    I have to disagree with this statement. There are those who simply don't play well with others and then there are those whose presence is a detriment to the whole. While I know some will not agree, I feel that if person X is a detriment to the whole then forum Y is not the place for person X. For your board to be successful, you definitely have to bite your tongue from time to time and put up with people you probably wouldn't want in your own house, but at some point you need to consider the needs of the many. I think that really is what should govern most decisions... are you taking care of your members as a whole... not are you pandering to one person and allowing them to be a nuisance and a troublemaker so you can appear to be "tolerant" and politically correct?

  11. #11

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    Re: Hypothetical Cross-Forum Conduct

    ART ANDREWS said: View Post
    While I know some will not agree, I feel that if person X is a detriment to the whole then forum Y is not the place for person X. For your board to be successful, you definitely have to bite your tongue from time to time and put up with people you probably wouldn't want in your own house, but at some point you need to consider the needs of the many. I think that really is what should govern most decisions... are you taking care of your members as a whole... not are you pandering to one person and allowing them to be a nuisance and a troublemaker so you can appear to be "tolerant" and politically correct?
    I think you just hit the nail on the head right there. I agree, and that's what I was trying to argue in my posts, but I couldn't phrase it just right. Well said.

    If in doubt, warning, then ban;that would be my choice for this hypothetical situation. More likely than not, the warning will push them to do something that would give you a perfectly legitimate reason to remove them, and then it becomes a win for the administrator anyway, and preserves your reputation for not putting up with nonsense.

  12. #12
    TR 4059's Avatar
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    Re: Hypothetical Cross-Forum Conduct

    Art said it well. When any group of people get together and socialize, there will be run in's between any two or more members of that group whether it be a basket weaving club or a church choir. If he is acting like a fool on one forum, he will eventually probably slip up on yours, and then that's your chance to ban.

  13. #13
    charlie's Avatar
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    Re: Hypothetical Cross-Forum Conduct

    Art definitely makes a good point. And I can agree with him. And I personally hate the very idea of politically correct. But I would also stress discretion and look at your motivation behind the banning. There are some forums I am a member of that have other members I can't stand. (And I daresay they think the same about me). However, everyone abides within the rules of the forum. Bickering and flaming is kept to a minimum (and rarely happens anyway). Are topics posted that I don't care for? Yes. Comments that I find inappropriate or unwarranted? Yes. But I recognize that it is a personal reaction on my part. Now, if they were acting in a manner disrupting to the forums, then I bring it up to mods to rein them in or kick them out. In response to one of your later replies, pilot, YES, a person's actions on one forum can (and should) prohibt membership on another. If someone is a jerk and disruptive on one forum, I would think you are certainly justified in believing they would be so on another forum. As varied as memberships in forums are, I do think tolerance has a place and does giving a warning about behavior. But tolerant does not equate to either stupid, spineless, or pandering. If member X is being a detriment to forum Y, ban him.

    Charlie

  14. #14
    bobamatt's Avatar
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    Re: Hypothetical Cross-Forum Conduct

    There seems to be a "It's mine and nobody else can have/see it" attitude in this hobby among some.

    People say there are no elitists. There are. There is no denying it. When someone has information or power that others don't, it will be used unfairly, maybe not right away, but eventually.

    It's just something humans have been trying to figure out ever since we could think.

    While the power may be theirs/yours to ban anyone, doing so in this manner seems like abuse of power. Regardless of ownership of the forums.

    If this person was a genuine threat to the community as a whole, be it through recasting, bad deals, pedophilia or the like, then yes, I feel a ban should be necessary, for the good of the whole.

    ....but if this person regularly contributed to the community positively, but just rubs one person the wrong way and that person happens to be a mod or owner, that's the textbook definition of abuse of power.

    If you do own the forum, you can do what ever you'd like, I suppose. Your decisions and actions will be seen by members of your community. Even decisions that make you look like a jerk.

    In my humble opinion, of course.
    Last edited by bobamatt; Dec 29, 2008 at 2:41 PM.

  15. #15
    I helped at SDCC '08 NovallTalon's Avatar
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    Re: Hypothetical Cross-Forum Conduct

    ART ANDREWS said: View Post
    I have to disagree with this statement. There are those who simply don't play well with others and then there are those whose presence is a detriment to the whole. While I know some will not agree, I feel that if person X is a detriment to the whole then forum Y is not the place for person X. For your board to be successful, you definitely have to bite your tongue from time to time and put up with people you probably wouldn't want in your own house, but at some point you need to consider the needs of the many. I think that really is what should govern most decisions... are you taking care of your members as a whole... not are you pandering to one person and allowing them to be a nuisance and a troublemaker so you can appear to be "tolerant" and politically correct?

    This statement is pretty much the essence of being a forum admin or mod.

    There are going to be people you don't care much for that are regulars on your board, and as long as they are constructive and abiding by your rules then there isn't much you can do without looking like you have no regard for your own rules. However when said person does become a problem, you have to nip it and nip it fast before they begin to split your forum members. That is a HUGE problem when it happens that leaves lots of bitter feelings and scars that take a very very long time to mend.

    One thing you have to remember also is that your rules are your governance power. If you break your own rules, you make yourself an ineffectual leader/mod/admin at that point. If someone is doing something on another forum you don't care for, then you really can't do much about it unless you have something in your TOS that explains why you would/could. Something like this:

    "Members forum accounts are subject to review if members are found to be misrepresenting XXX forum community on the web, in public, or in any situation that may cause an unrecoverable deformation of the XXX forum community."

    Thats pretty generalist, but I think you get the point. On the Mercs boards, if we get any bashing of other clubs...we lock it on sight and may/may not issue a warning if it's bad enough. Thank god thats a rarity.

    Being a forum admin/mod is probably one of the most difficult jobs. It's an unpaid, sometimes thankless job. It can be really hard to be fair and not let personal feelings get in the way (you really have to learn this, and then make yourself practice it). Then you have to be able to leave your personal problems with people at the logout screen, because when/if your community becomes big enough...you become a genre comminuty organizer and have to be able to work with and for everyone.

    Hope that helps your question man. You gotta be fair and honest, always...if you let person feelings get in the way then you can be neither.

  16. #16
    Admin Staff webchief's Avatar
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    Re: Hypothetical Cross-Forum Conduct

    NovallTalon said: View Post
    You gotta be fair and honest, always...if you let person feelings get in the way then you can be neither.
    VERY true. Believe me, there are folks who push our buttons as Admins but we do our best to let personal feelings stay out of the equation and just do our jobs. The forum's needs must come first.

  17. #17

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    Re: Hypothetical Cross-Forum Conduct

    Thanx a bunch guys
    i posted on several forums & got many different slants on it

  18. #18
    fettpride's Avatar
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    Re: Hypothetical Cross-Forum Conduct

    Pardon if I'm echoing anything that someone else said. I didn't read everything

    I feel as if though it would be an abuse of authority, yes. However, I think there are exceptions to the rule.

    There are certain cases when this happens where there have been threats of bodily harm for instance. In cases like this, I believe that it would be in the best interest of a non affiliated forum to at least discuss the possibility of removing a "cross over member" for such conduct. If a member is conducting himself/herself like that elsewhere, he/she could be a threat to anyone no matter where they hang out.

    But name calling, and general trash talk ... eh A big gray area. It's been happening to me on another forum for quite some time, and I'm powerless. But even if I had some authority somewhere else, I don't think I would do it.

    Just my 2 cents buddy

    FP

  19. #19
    I helped at SDCC '08 MandalorFett's Avatar
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    Re: Hypothetical Cross-Forum Conduct

    OK Nate, what did you do this time?

  20. #20

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    Re: Hypothetical Cross-Forum Conduct

    MandalorFett said: View Post
    OK Nate, what did you do this time?

    Nothiiiiiing....



    I said it was hypothetical

  21. #21
    CGClone's Avatar
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    Re: Hypothetical Cross-Forum Conduct

    I think one very important point has been left out.

    Are you speaking of your own private forum or a public forum? Forums are not for everyone.

    If its an invite only, limited registration on a forum for something very specific, the rules are generally known to the members to play by them or youre gone.

    If its open to the public, then yes, Art and Webchief have said it well, feelings aside, you admin/mod judiciously.

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