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Help,I am a BSS victim.

  1. #51
    TeamFett's Avatar
    Member Since
    Apr 2005
    From
    Flagstaff, Arizona
    Posts
    1,303

    Re: Help,I am a BSS victim.

    Stealing credit cards is against the law, just as is stealing peoples' money. They pay him, and never recieve their stuff. That is illegal. It's fraud.

    He's also not flying low enough to avoid scrutiny, because here we are, people know about him, 501st members included.

    He is stealing money, not in the name of the Legion directly, but selling Star Wars props while being part of a SW community is relevance enough.



    No further questions, the defense rests, party at my house

  2. #52
    formerly Boba_Fett_03 Duran_Lomax's Avatar
    Member Since
    Mar 2004
    From
    Colorado
    Posts
    253

    Re: Help,I am a BSS victim.

    batninja said: View Post
    *sigh*

    See, BSS doesn't plaster his business on the side of his vehicle, he doesn't set up a booth at 501st events to sell his wares, and he doesn't advertise on any popular websites. He's flying under the radar just enough to avoid direct scrutiny, skeletons or not.

    He is not doing anything to intentionally damage the 501st's reputation as a whole. Now, if he stole a 501st member's credit cards or identity, then yes, the Legion would kick him out in a heartbeat (and report him to the proper authorities).

    This is simply a case where someone got ripped by an individual. It doesn't matter if the individual is a member of the 501st, the Boy Scouts, or the Mormon Tabernacle Choir. It's a law enforcement matter, not a Legion matter.

    If the perp steals a car in the name of the Legion, then obviously there is cause for banishment.

    Now, if the Legion decides to boot him for these allegations, then it will happen based on testimony from all parties concerned, beginning with his Garrison command staff. If they decide to handle it away from Legion HQ, then that's their call.

    My point is, don't assume that it's the Legion's duty to enforce a ban on someone who hasn't disrupted 501st operations.

    There are obviously disagreements with my opinion, so I will try to refrain from posting any further. To each his own.

    So, because BSS doesnt rip off 501st members, he's allowed to stay? That's the same as BSS being a member of TDH, but being allowed to stay because he doesnt rip off TDH members.
    You would think that an individual would be ousted for breaking the law in such a fashion; in many quality groups, this would have been done. A group like the 501st or TDH are not law-enforcement agencies, agreed, but they have a certain responsibility regarding their members.

    And to make things clear, I am not arguing against your opinion, here; I am arguing against the 501st's stance on the issue. I think it's irresponsible and wrong.

  3. #53
    batninja's Avatar
    Member Since
    Jan 2003
    From
    Fort Worth, TX
    Posts
    1,900

    Re: Help,I am a BSS victim.

    Boba_Fett_03 said:
    So, because BSS doesnt rip off 501st members, he's allowed to stay? That's the same as BSS being a member of TDH, but being allowed to stay because he doesnt rip off TDH members.
    If BSS were still a member of TDH, and was ripping off his local church, then no, TDH wouldn't lift a finger to ban him from TDH as it would not be considered a TDH matter. It would be up to the local church to inform law enforcement and prosecute from there. If it were determined that I routinely steal the neighborhood kids' lunch money, would TDH ban me? On what grounds?

    As I mentioned before, the fact that BSS is a 501st member and a prop-making thief is an unfortunate coincidence of hobbies. But in our current legal system under the Constitution, a person is innocent until proven guilty. As such, this is a matter between the victim and the accused until the verdict is determined.

    Even were the Legion to kick him out, then what? If the victim does not prosecute, he is still free to recast, swindle and steal. The banishment from the 501st would've accomplished nothing since BSS deals mostly on eBay to unsuspecting customers. Most 501st members know to stay away.

    I am in no way defending BSS' actions (there are special rooms in heck for people like this), I simply want to reiterate that the 501st has no legal standing in the issue.

    One more thing...I hold no ill will against anyone who differs in opinion from me. These opinions are mine, and I would like to think that they are correct. No matter what the outcome, I think we may all learn a thing or two about the Legion's responsibility, and I look forward to the resolution, right or wrong. I have faith that all debaters feel the same way.

    Seacrest out!

  4. #54
    Admin Staff webchief's Avatar
    Member Since
    Mar 2002
    From
    Massachusetts
    Posts
    4,702

    Re: Help,I am a BSS victim.

    Well said Eric and its exactly what I've been trying to say. If people truly have a problem with BSS then they should contact the local authorities and deal with it from there. If you were ripped off by someone who sold you something on Ebay should he be fired from his job for it?

    That being said, the person in question is a member of the 501st who is NOT in good standing. He has in affect been MIA and is not in contact with his local Garrison. His Garrison CO is in discussions about it with other folks and they are working on a solution from the 501st's stand point. If they deem there is enough evidence to proceed with expulsion from the Legion then they will do so. That's up to them. There is ZERO reason to debate it here on TDH considering this is NOT a 501st discussion forum. If you have issue with how the 501st police's itself then by all means bring it to the Legion Commander's attention. His contact information is quite easy to find on 501st.com and I'm sure if he gets your email he'd be happy to write back to you. BTW, the LCO (Mark Fordham) is a member of BSS's home Garrison and should be quite familiar with the situation.

    Thank you.

  5. #55
    Community Founder Art Andrews's Avatar
    Member Since
    Feb 2002
    From
    Las Vegas, NV
    Posts
    8,189

    Re: Help,I am a BSS victim.

    batninja said: View Post
    If BSS were still a member of TDH, and was ripping off his local church, then no, TDH wouldn't lift a finger to ban him from TDH as it would not be considered a TDH matter. It would be up to the local church to inform law enforcement and prosecute from there. If it were determined that I routinely steal the neighborhood kids' lunch money, would TDH ban me? On what grounds?
    While we won't get into a TDH/501st debate, I do want to make one point in regard to TDH's stance on criminal activity outside this board. TDH is not a bubble, isolated from the rest of the world. Your actions in your personal life COULD affect your membership here. For example: we do not want pedophiles here. Does someone molesting a child have anything to do with costumes or props? No, but we simply do not want that type of individual here at TDH. What grounds would we ban a convicted pedophile on? There is nothing in the Code of Conduct about it, but we would ban a pedophile to help ensure the protection of the members of this board and to ensure that this board remains a relatively safe place for minors/families to enjoy.

    Do not take this stance to an extreme and think that TDH is interested in or scrutinizing the personal lives of its members. It is not. However, there are instances in which we would respond to events that that took place outside the confines of this board.

    On a final note, you are welcome to disagree with how the 501st handles its affairs, but lets not allow this to degenerate into a 501st bashfest. The 501st does a lot of good, but, much like every organization, including TDH, it has its problems and its problem members.

    D

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