Page 1 of 7 123456 ... LastLast

Debate of EVO3s shirt design

  1. #1

    Debate of EVO3s shirt design

    http://www.thedentedhelmet.com/showthread.php?t=32894

    Ok, Now as you can tell I am against said shirt as I feel it does call or imply members of the 501st are recasters. Asok from the Admin staff has asked that any discussion on the shirt other than interest be discussed elsewhere. To that end I have started this thread. Please feel free to discuss but lets keep it civil.

    my issues with this are,

    1. I feel this shirt is offensive to members who belong to the 501st as it implies that they are recasters or support them.

    2. The creator of this item is using a copyrighted design in a way that is malicious.

    Lets discuss.

  2. #2
    Account Deactivated
    Member Since
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    3,530

    The EVO3 501st Anti-recaster T-shirt discussion thread.

    This thread is to discuss the T-shirt being offered by EVO3 here;
    http://www.thedentedhelmet.com/showthread.php?t=32894
    We do not want to derail his thread, so I have created this thread to discuss everyone's feelings on it.

    Here's the design;
    front

    back



    Dicuss your feelings freely. But keep it civil, lest we incur the wrath of the Mods.

  3. #3
    Account Deactivated
    Member Since
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    3,530

    Re: Debate of EVO3s shirt design

    Merged from another thread

  4. #4
    Account Deactivated
    Member Since
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    3,530

    Re: The EVO3 501st Anti-recaster T-shirt discussion thread.

    Merged from another thread

  5. #5
    asok's Avatar
    Member Since
    Dec 2002
    From
    Indiana
    Posts
    2,708

    Re: Debate of EVO3s shirt design

    Merged.

    Guys and Gals, you will keep this civil. I am not asking but telling you. Please also read the last line of my sig.

  6. #6
    TK2280's Avatar
    Member Since
    Nov 2006
    From
    Livonia, MIchigan
    Posts
    462

    Re: Debate of EVO3s shirt design

    Well every thing is a recast of some kind. The only ones permited by LFL to make the costume/armor parts are the companies that they let do it.

    recast'n or maken your own, Still is not legal to do. So unless you have a permision slip from LFL.... you are breaking the laws. Just cause you made your own will not protect you from the Lawyers of LFL. if any thing the guys who make there own stuff are a bigger target for LFL to take down.

    This is dumb and a dumb shirt. Hell 501st should send word of this to LFL and get this guy sued for using a stormtrooper logo

  7. #7
    Naglium's Avatar
    Member Since
    Feb 2009
    From
    Beverly, MA
    Posts
    240

    Re: Debate of EVO3s shirt design

    i dont like the shirt, and won't get one.. i think the more we focus on the negative sides of this hobby, the more un-fun it gets.. i joined cuz i enjoy star wars, i like making kids smile. thats why i dont get involved in the politics of issues like this. by making the shirt, he is putting a spotlight on a negative issue, and thus, taking away from the hobby..

    BTW, as a garrison merchandise officer, he needs legion approval to use the legion logo...

  8. #8
    I helped at SDCC '08 TK-Devo's Avatar
    Member Since
    Jun 2005
    From
    Phoenix Arizona
    Posts
    500

    Re: Debate of EVO3s shirt design

    TK2280 said: View Post
    This is dumb and a dumb shirt. Hell 501st should send word of this to LFL and get this guy sued for using a stormtrooper logo
    That was possibly the stupidest comment thats ever been posted on this board and there has been some bad ones. Do you know how many hundreds of people uses stormtroopers and other star wars images in their work. Lucas doesn't care about you unless you start making a good amount of money with their images.

  9. #9
    formerly old_jedi_mind_trick Bobby Fett UK's Avatar
    Member Since
    Nov 2007
    From
    Manchester, England
    Posts
    1,453

    Re: Debate of EVO3s shirt design

    The design of the shirt is a little lost on me, but I get the message that 501 will allow recast costume parts to be included in there membership....right?

    The recasting thing is a subject that will always be part of the scene. I think that educating members is key to reducing the amount of recast parts that are floating around. I am sure that many people have bought an item in good faith which they may or may not have discovered later was a recast item. Now that I understand the problem i will only buy direct from vendors I know are the original makers, or parts offered with the original maker credited.

    As for an anti recaster shirt, I would support that, but not this particular shirt.

    I don't know what the 501st policy is re recasting, would anyone care to post it?

  10. #10

    Re: Debate of EVO3s shirt design

    The policy is that as a club they won't police recasting.
    I agree If it was simply an anti recasting shirt I would be in but this design, I feel, implies something that is not wholly true.

    this is the policy
    the 501st Legion does not condone, support, or encourage re-casting. It is, however, outside of the scope of this club's mission, charter, authority, jurisdiction, and purview to consume our time and energies as a volunteer organization in efforts to prosecute those who, of their own volition, choose to engage in re-casting.

  11. #11
    mrbungle's Avatar
    Member Since
    Oct 2008
    From
    ALABAMA!!!!!
    Posts
    568

    Re: Debate of EVO3s shirt design

    i can already see where this is going.
    recaster: you don't own the intellectual rights to the helmet
    prop maker : but i took my time and money to sculpt this helmet and i feel it is wrong for you to make copies of it.
    recaster: i don't care!!

    bottom line.


    recasting is stealing. supporting recasters is stealing.


    i support the shirt because MANY 501st members have recasted many helmets and armor artist have hand sculpted and are nice enough to offer it to people that want the stuff that artist produces. and some 501st members are not at all shy to tell you that they recasted something.

    support the prop makers or there will be no costumes to wear.

  12. #12

    Re: Debate of EVO3s shirt design

    Well a shirt like this is going to start debate...wow.."501st approved" would suggest they support it..and "no stance" is not the same thing..this shirt is disrespectful. The point of the 501st is to wear and share costumes, and technically has nothing to do with prop making. I wouldnt expect them to start policing that. thats what sites like this do. Do i support re-casting, hell no, do i support the 501st, yes i do, and that includes their decision to allow the group to police itself. we are adults are we not? i know plenty of 501st members that will not buy re-cast items, and all the members i know would not ever re-cast...including myself. so the statement on this shirt is just unwarranted, especially to lump the whole group into people who accept re-casting. That is just a totally untrue statement. it also makes the impression the 501st itself is producing recast items. Another misleading statement. My point has nothing to do with recasting itself, (though i am completely against it) but the ethics of this design slandering an entire group of mostly good and honest people
    Last edited by Darth Voorhees; Jul 5, 2009 at 10:43 PM.

  13. #13

    Re: Debate of EVO3s shirt design

    You just nailed why I found this shirt to be offensive.

  14. #14
    Account Deactivated 99centTaco's Avatar
    Member Since
    Mar 2006
    From
    San Antonio Texas
    Posts
    1,640

    Re: Debate of EVO3s shirt design

    - Do not approve of this shirt

  15. #15
    mrbungle's Avatar
    Member Since
    Oct 2008
    From
    ALABAMA!!!!!
    Posts
    568

    Re: Debate of EVO3s shirt design

    then the 501st should have a no recasting stance. by not having stance you are queitly supporting recasting.

  16. #16
    Account Deactivated
    Member Since
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    3,530

    Re: Debate of EVO3s shirt design

    I agree
    Darth Voorhees has summed it up for me as well

  17. #17
    vadr_h8r's Avatar
    Member Since
    Jan 2008
    From
    Greensburg Indiana
    Posts
    832

    Re: Debate of EVO3s shirt design

    recasting is all about honor. If you make a quick and easy mold from someone elses scratch built and designed hard work, they are going to be upset. but is it a legal matter? no, because they didn't have the rights to it either. are people going to be upset if you recasted a don post??? nope.... would the be mad if you racasted a Fettpride? ooohh yeah!!! Is it a double standard? absolutely! But that what happens when your a part of a tight-nit group like the TDH.

  18. #18
    Account Deactivated
    Member Since
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    3,530

    Re: Debate of EVO3s shirt design

    mrbungle said: View Post
    then the 501st should have a no recasting stance. by not having stance you are queitly supporting recasting.
    No
    that's not right
    The policy states

    "the 501st Legion does not condone, support, or encourage re-casting."

    That's the opposite of what you said.

  19. #19

    Re: Debate of EVO3s shirt design

    mrbungle said: View Post
    i can already see where this is going.
    recaster: you don't own the intellectual rights to the helmet
    prop maker : but i took my time and money to sculpt this helmet and i feel it is wrong for you to make copies of it.
    recaster: i don't care!!

    bottom line.


    recasting is stealing. supporting recasters is stealing.


    i support the shirt because MANY 501st members have recasted many helmets and armor artist have hand sculpted and are nice enough to offer it to people that want the stuff that artist produces. and some 501st members are not at all shy to tell you that they recasted something.

    support the prop makers or there will be no costumes to wear.
    I am in no way disagreeing with you. Recasting is the same as theft. What I don't like is blanket statements that this shirt makes.

  20. #20
    mrbungle's Avatar
    Member Since
    Oct 2008
    From
    ALABAMA!!!!!
    Posts
    568

    Re: Debate of EVO3s shirt design

    slave1pilot said: View Post
    No
    that's not right
    The policy states

    "the 501st Legion does not condone, support, or encourage re-casting."

    That's the opposite of what you said.
    then enforce the policy.

    i am buying one of these shirts!!! jus tincase you were wondering.

  21. #21
    EVO3's Avatar
    Member Since
    Apr 2004
    From
    Orange Park, FL.
    Posts
    108

    Re: Debate of EVO3s shirt design

    I guess that i should post here to defend myself.

    Ive been a member of the 501st for about 8 years now. my wife, almost just as long. The days of making every trooping event in my area are long gone. Life takes a front seat to all of that. The troops that i try to make without fail are the childrens hospital visits and i donate my time, shop and tools anytime they are needed for another member or any project thats used to raise money for a charity. I love the 501st and its mission. Its one of the reasons ive been around while many have come and gone. I also love building props. I used to do it for myself but branched out to molding and casting when people started asking for some of my stuff. I put a lot of time, money and sometimes blood, into the props i make. I have had one item of mine recast. I have a few other friends that have had their stuff recast. It flat out sucks. Especially if its done by another member of the 501st.

    The 501st has it written in their charter that if one member is caught stealing from another member, then he should get ejected. Well, in my opinion when someone takes my hard work and pours rubber over it, that is stealing. I know that some people here will pull out the IP card, but please, spare me from that ****. If it wasnt for people like SGB, Pghfett, SB and a few others, the 501st would be full of Rubies Vader and TK costumes and thats about it, because thats all that the make. Its the people that are mentioned above that bring the 501st to an elite costuming club. They should be protected by the 501st.

    Now i realize that the 501st cannot prosecute someone for recasting anothers work, but they can do what the Rebel Legion has written in their charter. Thats all i and a few others have ever asked for. I dont for a moment believe that this shirt will bring LFL to shut down the 501st. Please, its the 501st that keeps SW in the public eye.

    The point of the shirt that we've designed is simple. The 501st says that they choose not to deal with recasters. Im sure it has to do with the fact that our helmets are not licensed. So how can they? Well, i dont believe their logo is Copy Written. It cant be because it has the image of a TK on it. Theoretically, it can go both ways then. Its just a point we are trying to make.

    As ive said, i can respect everyones opinion here. I just ask that i get the same back. Theres plenty of people that i know in the real world that have differing views than me (over much more important topics than this) and they are still good friends of mine. In the end, no matter what, i still love building things in my shop, whether its just for me or to mold for others.

    Thats all i have to say....... for now.

  22. #22
    Account Deactivated
    Member Since
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    3,530

    Re: Debate of EVO3s shirt design

    mrbungle said: View Post
    then enforce the policy.
    The policy also states;
    "It is, however, outside of the scope of this club's mission, charter, authority, jurisdiction, and purview to consume our time and energies as a volunteer organization in efforts to prosecute those who, of their own volition, choose to engage in re-casting. "

    Each individual (not the "group" as a whole) should enforce their own policy to whatever extent they deem plausible.


    anyone else note the irony of using the 501st's logo to sell an an "anti-recasting" shirt?
    EVO3 doesn't have the rights to, nor did we spend the time and effort to create the logo.

  23. #23
    formerly Sgt. Skirata Huntman's Avatar
    Member Since
    May 2006
    Posts
    1,186

    Re: Debate of EVO3s shirt design

    This so needs to be locked. Nothing good can come of this

  24. #24
    Account Deactivated
    Member Since
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    3,530

    Re: Debate of EVO3s shirt design

    Sgt. Skirata said: View Post
    This so needs to be locked. Nothing good can come of this
    we're being civil, Sarge
    relax

  25. #25
    mrbungle's Avatar
    Member Since
    Oct 2008
    From
    ALABAMA!!!!!
    Posts
    568

    Re: Debate of EVO3s shirt design

    then change the policy like i said. because that is not good enough.

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 0
    Last Post: Oct 24, 2009, 8:20 PM
  2. fanboyarmy shirt design #1 (interest thread)
    By gbeef in forum The Sarlacc Pit
    Replies: 25
    Last Post: Mar 25, 2008, 10:03 AM
  3. Sintra VS metal the debate
    By Beowulf in forum Boba Fett Costume
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: Nov 27, 2004, 4:10 PM
  4. My New Cod Design
    By Jodo_Kast in forum Boba Fett Costume
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: Aug 5, 2004, 10:14 AM
  5. ESB sidearm....The speargun debate
    By Jodo Kast 3 in forum Boba Fett Costume
    Replies: 22
    Last Post: Jan 30, 2004, 5:36 PM
  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •